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Bat_Orchid90
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Member Since: Dec 2018
Location: N/a
Posts: 151
5 yr Member
Default Aug 25, 2020 at 07:58 AM
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yaowen View Post
Dear pandabear0927,

My heart goes out to you.

Everyone's situation has so many unique elements that I never feel like I am qualified to give advice. What follows is NOT advice but just sharing my own situation.

I basically built a wall between my father and myself for my own protection and sanity. He had many of the negative traits you describe in your post and some others. I had hateful feelings towards him until my depression and anxiety became manageable. I also blamed him for causing these illnesses in me. My feelings ran so strong that I refused to visit him when he was on his death bed in a nursing home.

These days I have some regrets about all this. I suspect now though I have no proof that my father suffered mental illness, [depression and OCD]. Males sometimes manifest these illnesses in nasty ways supposedly because depression is not a very macho thing. I read somewhere that they turn their self-hate outward to find relief from the pain.

My father had unrealistic expectations about what a son should be. I don't know, but sometimes I feel I had some unrealistic expectations about what a father should be. A lot of misery is caused by expectations. Expectations are burdens we place on others. We always hope they are just burdens and reasonable. Sometimes the mentally ill cannot meet these expectations and burdens. Their illness in a way poisons and reduces, not their free will but perhaps the full extent of their free will. It clouds their judgement and impedes their choices.

I am not trying to explain away anything or whitewash bad behavior.

There is a difference between the exercise of free will and the "full" exercise of free will. We can will things without willing them fully. I don't think it is the case that people at every moment of their lives will things with all their hearts, minds, power and strength. People can often find themselves in situations where they do not fully deliberate before acting. People can find themselves with limited knowledge and awareness and not even be aware of it. They can be blinded by prejudices. Often people live on the very surface of life and don't spend much time in introspection.

One of the best things that happens to people is when insights occur. Sadly insight has its own timetable and does not come when we want it or when we need it most. Often it comes after the fact or not at all.

The full exercise of freedom can often be impeded by strong emotions and habits.

Have you heard the expression "conflicting emotions." It refers to when a person is divided and conflicted. There is a little story that illustrates it. A captain in need of money takes on a precious cargo and passengers. The cargo is what really pays because it is precious. A storm comes and the captain becomes torn by conflicting emotions. He decides that in order to save the passengers he must throw the cargo overboard. Does he wish to do this? Only in part. Part of him does not want to do this because he needs the money so badly. So he wills to save the passengers and reluctantly wills to eject the cargo. This is an example of "conflicting emotions." Moral philosophers often say that conflicting emotions interfere not with free will but with the "full" exercise it.

Another consideration that I think about my father is this. There is bad and then there is bad. A couple of men in the last 100 years caused the destruction of tens of millions of men, women and children through genocidal policies. My father never did anything like this. Whatever bad he did was far, far, far, far, far away from the worst kind of bad action.

My father supported me and occasionally did some wonderful things for me. He once built me a very nice model train. He took my mother and me to the movies. He taught me many things like the appreciation of music. Although my father could be quite cruel he never liked to step on insects or hurt animals. And other things. There were things to appreciate and treasure in my father.

I wish I had done a bit more for my father now that he is gone. I doubt whether I could have done anything really big. I wish I could have done some little things though. A psychologist once told me that it is impossible to "look down" on another person unless one feels higher than that person. I spent many years feeling "higher" than my father and now I am not so sure. I am no saint and have many undesirable and ugly things about me.

At the same time, I don't really beat myself up over how I treated my father. I doubt whether my actions were done with the full force of my freewill, with full deliberation, knowledge, insight and consent. Things are what they are. Your description of your father sounds quite a bit like mine.

Advice though is "whole 'nother story." I would never second-guess you and offer you advice. I have a really bad record when it comes to giving advice. Advice can never take the unexpected into account. A friend of mine once advised an overworked coworker to take a trip to Hawaii. And he did. Unfortunately during one leg of the trip the plane crashed and the man and his whole family were lost. I try to keep that in mind when I am tempted to "suggest" things to others. I am not in your shoes and wouldn't DARE advice you!

You must do as you see fit. I think most people do the best they can at each moment of their lives given everything influencing them.

Finally I would like to say: I could easily be wrong about what I have written here. I am wrong about things often enough that I feel a called to have a little, what would you call it? Intellectual humility. Intellectual humility is called for in my case. Wish I had more of it.

There is an very old saying by the Chinese sage Lao Tzu. It goes . . . "I find good people to be good and I find bad people to be good, if I am good enough." I wish I had remembered that saying when my father was still alive.

I want wish you only the best in your life journey. I am so terribly, terribly sorry that things are so very far from ideal between you and your father.

Sincerely yours, Yao Wen

Thank you! I really appreciate your comment. And yes there a lot of things that you have mentioned that I take into consideration as well. And i think that’s what makes it so difficult to feel any type of way is because I’ve weighed these options. He has done some of the bad things that you’ve mentioned, and while you’re right people may have conflicting emotions that push them to do something they dont want to, youre also right that there is free will. A lot of the decisions my father has made are not just mistakes. Let’s face it, we all make them. Sometimes small and sometimes big. The issue is when you continue to repeat the behavior. Once is a mistake, you learn and you grow, twice, three times, several is a habit. THAT is what I don’t forgive. ESPECIALLY when there was never any sincere apology or acknowledgement of my pain. And i may never get that! And i am at peace with never getting that. I do think my father has issues he needs to work on and i dont think i could ever have a relationship with him unless he sought out professional help, but at the same time I cant be around someone who just resents me because of someone else. Often times if he was criticizing me it was because of my mother. I tried to not take it personally but growing up it still hurt. As an adult I’ve more or less accepted thats how he is and he needs to start taking responsibility for his own actions and I dont think he ever has. It was my mothers fault he never had money, not that he was stuck in the same dead end job all his life. Its his dads fault he doesnt know how to express himself or has these irrational fears, not his own for not seeking help or wanting to be a better father. It was my fault he was unhappy, not that hes just selfish... its always someone else. And thats what i got tired of hearing. It’s always someone else including myselfs fault why hes so miserable, why hes not in the job he wants, living in the house he wants, living the life he wants and i was tired of being his lightening rod for chaos. But again, at this point i know he’ll never change. I knew that a long time ago. So right now it’s just sad about those kids who are being poisoned by the lies and the bull that him and his gf are feeding them. Theyre settling for a mediocre life and then teaching all 3 kids that it’s the rest of the world that put them there. It’s sad. It’s disgusting... but what can you do ? Nothing but watch i guess... you cant change people... but itd be nice if some of my family would allow me the chance to speak instead of siding with him.. i feel like the day will come, when those kids are grown. If they come looking for me. I have no issue sitting down and really talking to them. But so long as theyre there. I cant have a relationship with any of them.... just that the more time goes by, the more awkward it becomes.
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