Expectations - Yours for yourself and/or from others

Jul 07, 2020 at 10:05 AM

I do hope this thread isn't moved. If it must be, then I understand and am sure it might resonate elsewhere, as well.

I'll leave the topic of expectations as a broad one. As I wrote in the title, I'm interested in how expectations for yourself and/or ones from others affect your life, as a person with bipolar disorder.

I'm not sure what words crop up in your mind again and again during struggles with the illness, but for me, the top two are "frustration" and "expectations". If anyone wishes to share some of the main words that crop up in your mind, as a person with bipolar illness, please share. I'm curious about this.

bpcyclist · Jul 07, 2020 at 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BirdDancer

I do hope this thread isn't moved. If it must be, then I understand and am sure it might resonate elsewhere, as well.

I'll leave the topic of expectations as a broad one. As I wrote in the title, I'm interested in how expectations for yourself and/or ones from others affect your life, as a person with bipolar disorder.

I'm not sure what words crop up in your mind again and again during struggles with the illness, but for me, the top two are "frustration" and "expectations". If anyone wishes to share some of the main words that crop up in your mind, as a person with bipolar illness, please share. I'm curious about this.

I try not to have them. I do have basic wishes,. Take meds right, eat, sleep, keep place cleanish, exercise, pray, not be so sick I have to go back to the hospital. I also wish for connection with others, to the extent that is possible for me.

I do tend to generally subscribe to the old timey AA/NA edict that more oftehn than not, expectations are just resentments that have not yet quite occurred. That fits for me.

FluffyDinosaur · Jul 07, 2020 at 10:41 AM

My main expectation from myself is to produce something worthwhile and lasting, like something that's still going to be around when I'm dead, a sort of legacy. I don't know why but that's always been important to me. I've always thought a lot about that even when I was little. When I'm too sick to accomplish much that frustrates me a lot. It makes me feel like I'm wasting my time and it's running out.

Jul 07, 2020 at 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bpcyclist

I try not to have them. I do have basic wishes,. Take meds right, eat, sleep, keep place cleanish, exercise, pray, not be so sick I have to go back to the hospital. I also wish for connection with others, to the extent that is possible for me.

I do tend to generally subscribe to the old timey AA/NA edict that more oftehn than not, expectations are just resentments that have not yet quite occurred. That fits for me.

That AA/NA edict sounds very reasonable and it's a good reminder.

I'm glad you are content with the basic wishes. I usually am, too, but I go through phases when I wish I had more. I usually have more expectations for myself than my husband has for me. He just wants me as well as possible and to keep loving him. I can definitely guarantee the latter.

Jul 07, 2020 at 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FluffyDinosaur

My main expectation from myself is to produce something worthwhile and lasting, like something that's still going to be around when I'm dead, a sort of legacy. I don't know why but that's always been important to me. I've always thought a lot about that even when I was little. When I'm too sick to accomplish much that frustrates me a lot. It makes me feel like I'm wasting my time and it's running out.

I think a lot of people are happy, and should be, about leaving behind children and grandchildren, and beyond. I totally get what you're talking about, though.

I am happy about a lot of what I've done, but likely no one will remember my name after I'm gone and those that love me are gone.

FluffyDinosaur · Jul 07, 2020 at 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BirdDancer

I think a lot of people are happy, and should be, about leaving behind children and grandchildren, and beyond. I totally get what you're talking about, though.

I am happy about a lot of what I've done, but likely no one will remember my name after I'm gone and those that love me are gone.

In a sense I think it's a flaw of character that I can't just be content with living my life. It certainly causes me a lot of stress and grief. I've tried to change and just be happy in the moment but it seems that that's just not how I'm wired. I try to do the best research I can and write the best books I can and make something meaningful in that way. The irony is that I've done some of my best work in those rare moments when I've let go and stopped trying to force it so much.

bpcyclist · Jul 08, 2020 at 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BirdDancer

That AA/NA edict sounds very reasonable and it's a good reminder.

I'm glad you are content with the basic wishes. I usually am, too, but I go through phases when I wish I had more. I usually have more expectations for myself than my husband has for me. He just wants me as well as possible and to keep loving him. I can definitely guarantee the latter.

You are so lucky to have each other!

*Beth* · Jul 08, 2020 at 11:01 AM

I was raised by a mother who refused to accept weakness, or anything less than perfect (which, of course, is impossible for anyone, but I kept trying). If I wasn't working to help her in the house or yard...well, things weren't good. I had to be working any time I wasn't in school. My mom had a mental illness and her behavior was erratic.

So that demand for self-perfection is well ingrained in me. I'm excruciatingly hard on myself. At the same time, I don't have the greatest stamina, especially on meds. So while I mentally "should" myself relentlessly, I physically give out and have to sleep.

As for others, my expectations are low. Honestly, I think to myself that if someone offers anything good to me, the offering itself is already more than I might deserve. I'm very grateful, but it's hard for me to believe someone truly cares, and that they won't reject me sooner or later.

With regard to my BD almost no one in my life knows about it. So I certainly don't expect any special consideration or care because I have a mental illness.

Sooo...I'm working in therapy on changing these patterns, being good with self-soothing, accepting that someone caring about me doesn't mean they will reject me, and so on.

Good thread, Birdie.

FluffyDinosaur · Jul 09, 2020 at 07:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BethRags

I was raised by a mother who refused to accept weakness, or anything less than perfect (which, of course, is impossible for anyone, but I kept trying). If I wasn't working to help her in the house or yard...well, things weren't good. I had to be working any time I wasn't in school. My mom had a mental illness and her behavior was erratic.

So that demand for self-perfection is well ingrained in me. I'm excruciatingly hard on myself. At the same time, I don't have the greatest stamina, especially on meds. So while I mentally "should" myself relentlessly, I physically give out and have to sleep.

As for others, my expectations are low. Honestly, I think to myself that if someone offers anything good to me, the offering itself is already more than I might deserve. I'm very grateful, but it's hard for me to believe someone truly cares, and that they won't reject me sooner or later.

With regard to my BD almost no one in my life knows about it. So I certainly don't expect any special consideration or care because I have a mental illness.

Sooo...I'm working in therapy on changing these patterns, being good with self-soothing, accepting that someone caring about me doesn't mean they will reject me, and so on.

Good thread, Birdie.

Thanks for sharing this, a lot of it resonates with me. I also had a mentally ill mother, and I can relate to being hard on yourself but not on others, and being unable to believe anyone really cares about you. My therapist thinks those issues are part of the reason why the whole covid situation hit me so hard, with the sudden loss of access to therapy, and why that felt like such a betrayal. I haven't worked it all out yet but I thought maybe there's a similar connection in your case.

Jul 09, 2020 at 07:46 AM

I guess my take from the intentionally broad question veers off a little bit. My expectation for myself is basically be self-reliant and independent. My burdens shouldn’t be anyone else’s and in most circumstances I see myself as the one who needs “expectations” —- I should expect others to act like themselves while I must hold myself to a standard that isn’t really conceivable or healthy. I’m hard on myself and I want to be able to do things myself. It’s defeating to have to ask for help. You may ask where that comes from. Actually, it’s a place of fear. If I distance myself from others — I can’t hurt them and they can’t hurt me. I’m responsible for me and me alone and any success and failure is my own. This gets problematic sometimes but I’ve grown out of it a little knowing we have to interact and also rely on others sometimes. If it weren’t for help of others. I doubt I’d have anything I have today.

Anyway, back on course, my point is the only expectation I have is that I can’t expect anything from anyone but myself and I ask for too much.

Jul 09, 2020 at 08:16 AM

when I dropped out of school, my mother wasn't happy, and rather admit to herself that I had a problem, and my reasons, she convinced others for months I was training to be a lawyer. it was actually really embarrassing, especially for people who fell for it and came to test me and ask me legal stuff.

main expectations for myself are

1. not to make myself out as the poor sick person- oh I have bipolar, oh I have fibro, I can't do anything, etc etc

and 2. just to be happy with what I've got. don't over do it, and live for myself- not for others

3. to accept people for who they are and don't judge (I've had enough judgement myself)

*Beth* · Jul 09, 2020 at 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FluffyDinosaur

Thanks for sharing this, a lot of it resonates with me. I also had a mentally ill mother, and I can relate to being hard on yourself but not on others, and being unable to believe anyone really cares about you. My therapist thinks those issues are part of the reason why the whole covid situation hit me so hard, with the sudden loss of access to therapy, and why that felt like such a betrayal. I haven't worked it all out yet but I thought maybe there's a similar connection in your case.

Yes. I have a strong intuition that we share a number of background experiences.

Are you able to do teletherapy? I am, but the sudden changeover from in person to tele...honestly, I flipped out. I felt betrayed, abandoned, and generally screwed over by the entire universe. It took me a month, but I've finally resigned myself to teletherapy; I'm bearing with it, and some good has come of it.

FluffyDinosaur · Jul 09, 2020 at 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BethRags

Yes. I have a strong intuition that we share a number of background experiences.

Are you able to do teletherapy? I am, but the sudden changeover from in person to tele...honestly, I flipped out. I felt betrayed, abandoned, and generally screwed over by the entire universe. It took me a month, but I've finally resigned myself to teletherapy; I'm bearing with it, and some good has come of it.

Yes, I had the same reaction to teletherapy, especially the sudden changeover. I was already in a nasty episode at the time, and I had expected my therapist to be there for me to help me through it. With the sudden change to teletherapy it felt pretty much exactly as you describe, like a gross betrayal. I felt like the fact that they just dropped me like that in the midst of an episode showed that they didn't really give a damn. I ended up in a full crisis and now I'm still dealing with the fallout, as I think you are, too.

Luckily the crisis team that I eventually ended up seeing was able to offer me face-to-face therapy to bridge the gap and there was a Pdoc there that I really like who helped me a lot. I'm actually kind of sad I can't see her anymore. Now I'm back with my regular therapist and trying to rebuild, but it takes time.

I suppose if they had told me in advance that we would do teletherapy and it was only for a few weeks, I might have been able to deal with it. But in general I just don't feel the same kind of connection with teletherapy. And now that this has happened I think I'm less able to deal with teletherapy or gaps between my sessions than I was before. Now I'm even having trouble with one session per week, bridging the gap from one session to the next.

*Beth* · Jul 09, 2020 at 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FluffyDinosaur

Yes, I had the same reaction to teletherapy, especially the sudden changeover. I was already in a nasty episode at the time, and I had expected my therapist to be there for me to help me through it. With the sudden change to teletherapy it felt pretty much exactly as you describe, like a gross betrayal. I felt like the fact that they just dropped me like that in the midst of an episode showed that they didn't really give a damn. I ended up in a full crisis and now I'm still dealing with the fallout, as I think you are, too.

All of that. Yes. The feeling of being dropped on the ground was nothing less than traumatic.

Luckily the crisis team that I eventually ended up seeing was able to offer me face-to-face therapy to bridge the gap and there was a Pdoc there that I really like who helped me a lot. I'm actually kind of sad I can't see her anymore. Now I'm back with my regular therapist and trying to rebuild, but it takes time.

That's good, good that you were able to have that support during a very vulnerable time.

I'm doing better with teletherapy than I had expected to; nevertheless, I'm prepared for therapy to entirely fall apart and end at any time. It's not a good feeling, at all. I can't shake it. Like you said, it will take time, and a lot of patience.

I suppose if they had told me in advance that we would do teletherapy and it was only for a few weeks, I might have been able to deal with it. But in general I just don't feel the same kind of connection with teletherapy. And now that this has happened I think I'm less able to deal with teletherapy or gaps between my sessions than I was before. Now I'm even having trouble with one session per week, bridging the gap from one session to the next.

I see my therapist twice per week. To wait a full week became very, very difficult, so a few months back I asked if we could do 2 times per week. She agreed. Is there any possibility for you to see your therapist 2 times/week?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Pookyl · Jul 09, 2020 at 09:20 PM

I try not to put expectations on myself. I’ve found that leads to immense frustration.

FluffyDinosaur · Jul 10, 2020 at 01:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BethRags

That's good, good that you were able to have that support during a very vulnerable time.

I'm doing better with teletherapy than I had expected to; nevertheless, I'm prepared for therapy to entirely fall apart and end at any time. It's not a good feeling, at all. I can't shake it. Like you said, it will take time, and a lot of patience.

Yes, I also have that feeling of dread that it could fall apart at any time. It's not the solid foundation it used to be. I hate that feeling.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BethRags

I see my therapist twice per week. To wait a full week became very, very difficult, so a few months back I asked if we could do 2 times per week. She agreed. Is there any possibility for you to see your therapist 2 times/week?

Unfortunately twice a week isn't possible with my current therapist.

The place where she works doesn't offer that kind of care. To get twice a week appointments I would have to go to a different place, which I'm hesitant to do because I don't want to lose my current therapist and have to build an entirely new relationship with someone else.

Miss Laura · Jul 10, 2020 at 07:02 AM

I have high hopes/expectations for myself and others. Always have had. I'm forever being told to lower them but it's so hard.

FluffyDinosaur · Jul 10, 2020 at 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miss Laura

I have high hopes/expectations for myself and others. Always have had. I'm forever being told to lower them but it's so hard.

It really is. When it comes to personal expectations and ambitions I'm not sure it's even possible to give up on those, at least not without a drastic personality change. Nor am I convinced that it's necessarily better to lower expectations of yourself (though I'm sure it would be more comfortable).

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Pookyl Poohbah Member Since Aug 2017 Location: Australia Posts: 1,435 6 79 hugs given	Jul 09, 2020 at 09:20 PM #15 I try not to put expectations on myself. I’ve found that leads to immense frustration. __________________ Pookyl ———————————————————————————— BP1, GAD, Panic Disorder, Agoraphobia, Claustrophobia Psych meds: Saphris, Seroquel XR, regular Seroquel. PRN Diazepam and Zopiclone
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Miss Laura Elder Member Since Sep 2008 Location: Scotland, UK Posts: 5,244 15 85 hugs given	Jul 10, 2020 at 07:02 AM #17 I have high hopes/expectations for myself and others. Always have had. I'm forever being told to lower them but it's so hard.
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