Agree or Not?

I read the following on Quora. The woman who wrote it is a neurophysiologist. (She is not a medical doctor. She does not have bipolar disorder.) I'm interested to know what the people on this board think about what she's written:

You are not in a manic episode if you are organized, feeling happy, in control and have a clean, orderly home. If manic, your house would be littered with unfinished projects, piles of clothes and unopened boxes and other containers that indicate excessive spending. You would be incapable of recognizing that your body is begging for sleep, and this exhaustion could lead to a car accident or to a lesser degree, a horrid argument with your best friend.

Even when you are hypomanic (a step “below” mania), you are likely to be irritating as easily as charming and interesting. Honest self-awareness is almost impossible when your spirits are so elevated. The difference between these two mood states is demonstrated by two people on a mountain ledge. They both have exceeded their climbing skills because their moods are super-elevated, but while one person is soaking in the beauty and being overly verbose, the other is pressing on, ignoring obvious dangers; he has no oxygen tanks, cold-weather apparel or proper equipment but he persists in climbing. If a psychotic break happens, all bets are off!

some truths I suppose.....
bizi

I didn't read the entire context or the question she answered, but I find this lacking. She offers a stereotypical presentation. It doesn't account for a number of scenarios that live outside of the typically understood euphoric mania such as dysphoric or mixed mania. Here we all know bipolar is a very complex disorder with a wide spectrum of presentations that can shift for people episode to episode.

My house was quite clean when I went off the rails. I didn't buy anything. I knew my sleep was disturbed and that it was a problem. I did not have boundless energy. I knew bad things were happening.

I agree, fern. I read her reply and wanted to scream.

btw, the question she replied to was about someone wanting to know if she could bring on a manic state at will.

When I'm manic, one of the clear signs for me is that I go at projects 110% and I complete them. I will usually have several projects going on at once. But they'll all be finished, even if it means that I'm cracking up. In fact, the harder I work, the more manic I become.

I agree this is a stereotypical description. I avoid Quora when I can because it's so full of armchair psychologists and pseudo-intellectuals who spew bs with such confidence that they make it seem like a fact. Sometimes against my better judgment I go to a Quora page in my search results, and sometimes it's good but especially when it comes to mental illness I usually just end up getting very angry at the misinformation and wishing I could yell through my screen at all the other people reading it not to believe that nonsense. It's full of people making all kinds of outrageous claims about what (hypo)mania is even though they've never experienced it, saying that depression isn't real, confusing bipolar with borderline, and lots of other stuff that pisses me off.

Best to avoid claims made by people whom don't have much experience with this subject. Luckily i am SURE many people in this forum Already know that but it is worrying that other people may read certain claims and take it as true without further research. Be Careful. SEnding many Safe, warm hugs to ALL of You, Your Families, Your FriEnds And ALL of Your Loved Ones! Keep fighting And keep rocking NO MATTER WHAT HAPPENS, OK?!

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Originally Posted by FluffyDinosaur I agree this is a stereotypical description. I avoid Quora when I can because it's so full of armchair psychologists and pseudo-intellectuals who spew bs with such confidence that they make it seem like a fact. Sometimes against my better judgment I go to a Quora page in my search results, and sometimes it's good but especially when it comes to mental illness I usually just end up getting very angry at the misinformation and wishing I could yell through my screen at all the other people reading it not to believe that nonsense. It's full of people making all kinds of outrageous claims about what (hypo)mania is even though they've never experienced it, saying that depression isn't real, confusing bipolar with borderline, and lots of other stuff that pisses me off.

Hmm, thanks FluffyD! I don't spend much time on Quora for the very reasons you've stated...I thought it was just me who finds flaws with much of the "knowledge" some people claim to have. Meh. I think I'll stop getting myself worked up over stupidity and avoid their mental illness sections. (Not that I've found other topics on Quora to be any better.)

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Originally Posted by MickeyCheeky Best to avoid claims made by people whom don't have much experience with this subject. Luckily i am SURE many people in this forum Already know that but it is worrying that other people may read certain claims and take it as true without further research. Be Careful. SEnding many Safe, warm hugs to ALL of You, Your Families, Your FriEnds And ALL of Your Loved Ones! Keep fighting And keep rocking NO MATTER WHAT HAPPENS, OK?!

Hey there, MC! What a treat to run into you! I hope you are well and staying safe.

I also agree that it is a stereotypical description. It's actually pretty dangerous to tell people that they do or don't have something if they do or don't have certain exact symptoms. Sounds to me that that writer either doesn't fully understand the disorder, or has a very limited view of it.

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Originally Posted by Soupe du jour I also agree that it is a stereotypical description. It's actually pretty dangerous to tell people that they do or don't have something if they do or don't have certain exact symptoms. Sounds to me that that writer either doesn't fully understand the disorder, or has a very limited view of it.

Well put. I think that was my primary concern, that this person was diagnosing who knows how many people, complete strangers she knows nothing about.

I don't like her "*I* am the authority on bipolar disorder, and what I say is what it is!" attitude. She's not bipolar so she can stuff it!

I agree with pretty much everyone else on this. She clearly has not seen or experienced the various ways mania can present itself.

I kind of get annoyed by the lack of distinctions. I mean, we all know the parameters and delimitation of Bipolar, because we experience it and often they are rather unique to the person... but come on, take a average reader. It almost feels like sensationalist work "If you are talkative and unorganized, YOU COULD HAVE BIPOLAR". It's so vague and generic the quality fits 95% of people, and they only qualify it with "to an extreme".


In her case, her scope of how mania or hypomania manifests is very narrow. It seems misinformed more than understood from the likes of it. You throw in some nuggets of understanding, a want to "debunk" common misconceptions by yet again, creating a parallel misconception that it has to look like X for it to be the disorder.... I give up.

All that said, I think we should probably give the author a little slack -- a writer is writing for a specific audience and there's a need to have an authoritarian or expert tone in the mix when you're banking on using your professional credentials as leverage. I think the writing style of it was off putting to me, but I don't think much harm was actually intended. Maybe I'm mis-reading the entire thing. Hell if I know. haha

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Originally Posted by MarcusAurelius I kind of get annoyed by the lack of distinctions. I mean, we all know the parameters and delimitation of Bipolar, because we experience it and often they are rather unique to the person... but come on, take a average reader. It almost feels like sensationalist work "If you are talkative and unorganized, YOU COULD HAVE BIPOLAR". It's so vague and generic the quality fits 95% of people, and they only qualify it with "to an extreme". In her case, her scope of how mania or hypomania manifests is very narrow. It seems misinformed more than understood from the likes of it. You throw in some nuggets of understanding, a want to "debunk" common misconceptions by yet again, creating a parallel misconception that it has to look like X for it to be the disorder.... I give up. All that said, I think we should probably give the author a little slack -- a writer is writing for a specific audience and there's a need to have an authoritarian or expert tone in the mix when you're banking on using your professional credentials as leverage. I think the writing style of it was off putting to me, but I don't think much harm was actually intended. Maybe I'm mis-reading the entire thing. Hell if I know. haha

She was replying to a question someone asked. The question was Can I induce mania in myself. And this chickie came along like she's a specialist in treating BD. Thing is, she's neither a provider nor a patient. Where she's getting her information, I have no clue.

I posted here because I was curious as to what those of you here thought about her reply. I thought it was BS.

That does change the narrative quite a bit. I take back my statement of giving some slack, that's really borderline unprofessional of her to even post that slop.

I think that's incredibly damaging. I had a PDoc tell me I wasn't bipolar because I could think through the consequences even if I didn't care about them. I've been able to hide it and "function" enough to raise my child. I'm an expert at hiding. The only way you would know with me is me being trusting enough (paranoia) to share my thoughts. It often comes if you look at my accounts, across my skin (SH), and the few people I let in and a bouncing leg. I get really quiet because I'm hiding my pressured speech. I'll lay in bed to fake "sleep" for hours. I really have pretending mastered My house isn't more or less dirty.

I'm more augmentative (Barely), I'm overwhelmed, in my head, considering divorce, feeling trapped, ED raging, body moving, thirsty, confused, Idea jumping, Want to start projects but never do, I use to register for college every time I was manic, I look goal driven, outgoing But I don't look manic or psychotic. That's why my Dx is so iffy. Everyone here knows I belong here. But reaching out and explaining isn't my style.

I'm glad you started this topic because I've also been wondering whether it was just me.

I agree. There's already plenty of misinformation out there, we don't need more. Even professionals sometimes have these stereotypical views, and it's incredibly frustrating when they don't take you as seriously as they should just because you're trying your damnedest to salvage what's left of your life.

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Originally Posted by Miguel'smom I think that's incredibly damaging. I had a PDoc tell me I wasn't bipolar because I could think through the consequences even if I didn't care about them. I've been able to hide it and "function" enough to raise my child. I'm an expert at hiding. The only way you would know with me is me being trusting enough (paranoia) to share my thoughts. It often comes if you look at my accounts, across my skin (SH), and the few people I let in and a bouncing leg. I get really quiet because I'm hiding my pressured speech. I'll lay in bed to fake "sleep" for hours. I really have pretending mastered My house isn't more or less dirty. I'm more augmentative (Barely), I'm overwhelmed, in my head, considering divorce, feeling trapped, ED raging, body moving, thirsty, confused, Idea jumping, Want to start projects but never do, I use to register for college every time I was manic, I look goal driven, outgoing But I don't look manic or psychotic. That's why my Dx is so iffy. Everyone here knows I belong here. But reaching out and explaining isn't my style.

I so relate to your post.

My pdoc has said that some people with BD have a strong "executive personality", meaning the part of a personality that they show to others.

This is so stereotypical and outright inaccurate that I don’t even know where to begin in tearing it apart piece by piece. Makes me mad.