advertisement
Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
smlawnz
New Member
smlawnz has no updates.
 
Member Since: Dec 2016
Location: VA
Posts: 9
5 yr Member
1 hugs
given
Unhappy Apr 01, 2018 at 05:36 PM
  #1
All I see on Quora is how pitiful of an excuse for a human being Narcissists are. I asked if there were any conversations that didn't make us out to be baby eating ax murderers. Boy what a mistake!!

I am just so hurt by coming to the realization of who and what I am. I didn't choose not to have been given the opportunities in childhood that others got. I don't want to hurt the people around me. I don't know how to be anything other that what I am. I don't know how to fix myself. Even when you read articles by therapists they disagree on if you can even treat a narcissist.

I'm just looking for help. I am ready to admit my flaws. I want to change. I can not keep living my life this way. I don't mean anybody any harm, I don't think I am even aware of the things that I do or what the true meaning of those things are to others.

I just want to get better.
smlawnz is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
 
Hugs from:
Bill3, Fuzzybear, mote.of.soul, mwaxy
 
Thanks for this!
Atypical_Disaster

advertisement
here today
Grand Magnate
here today has no updates.
 
Member Since: Jun 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 3,515
10 yr Member
1,429 hugs
given
PC PoohBah!
Default Apr 02, 2018 at 02:49 PM
  #2
Welcome. What a refreshing post.

I don't exactly have NPD but do have some characteristics like it, and I'm at a point in my life where I want to be honest, and I like others who can be, too. I'm looking for interactions with other people, where honesty and straight feedback from others is valued more highly than avoiding hurt.

I believe that's the best way for me to learn and understand things.

For instance, I'm dealing now with a situation where I was (too) honest with a group of people and now don't have those "relationships" any more. However, it had been increasingly, not decreasingly, apparent for some time that keeping those relationships meant nobody talking about conflicts. So there increasingly was not anything "there" for me, and meeting with the folks felt like a burden sometimes, even though I care about them all. And don't like that actions that seemed necessary to me probably hurt them.

I'd like to talk about it and get some feedback, to try to sort out where things were my "bad", where the situation was just difficult to impossible, etc. I doubt that I will ever get myself into a situation like that one again, but there may be others that I could be vulnerable to, so I'd like to understand this one as much as I can.

Would anything like that appeal to your? Writing about your own situation, I mean, and getting perspective and feedback? Doesn't mean the other person is necessarily "right" of course, just a difference, and therefore maybe broadening, of perspective?

Might "hurt", too, but oh well -- if the person means to hurt you, then that's on them. When I recognize that intention, then what they say doesn't bother me (very much). If the person doesn't mean to hurt you, well this kind of thing happens when people are being straight sometime. I've gotten relatively good at tolerating and sitting through hurt, learning what I can sometimes.
here today is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
 
Hugs from:
Fuzzybear
 
Thanks for this!
Atypical_Disaster, mote.of.soul
smlawnz
New Member
smlawnz has no updates.
 
Member Since: Dec 2016
Location: VA
Posts: 9
5 yr Member
1 hugs
given
Default Apr 03, 2018 at 07:22 AM
  #3
Yes I would like to continue the conversation. I have an appointment Monday to see if the therapist I haven't seen in 2 years is willing to work with me. It's such a hassle trying to get help. The insurance companies don't want to cover any therapy that isn't for treating depression.

I read an article the other day about nietzsche's metamorphoses the camel the lion the child. It gave me hope. I was feeling like what was the point of going thru all the pain of trying to change. It took a whole lifetime to get to this point, do I want to spend the rest of my life trying to fix me??

The answer is yes! I want to live my life with childlike wonder and amazement and free of the past.
smlawnz is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
 
Thanks for this!
largebluerock, mote.of.soul
here today
Grand Magnate
here today has no updates.
 
Member Since: Jun 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 3,515
10 yr Member
1,429 hugs
given
PC PoohBah!
Default Apr 03, 2018 at 08:49 PM
  #4
My last therapist didn't help with the personality issues but did help with trauma. I didn't feel very understood by her. It got very messy at the end. So, I've wondered if people with personality disorders might be able to help each other, if we are willing to be as honest as we can at the moment (stuff may be unconscious so we can't take charge of that until it is!). And accept the other people as they are, even if/when they piss us off, etc. But it's just an idea and might not work after all.

Good luck with your appointment! Would you like to post about a struggle or situation you've got currently?
here today is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
 
Thanks for this!
mote.of.soul
smlawnz
New Member
smlawnz has no updates.
 
Member Since: Dec 2016
Location: VA
Posts: 9
5 yr Member
1 hugs
given
Confused Apr 04, 2018 at 09:18 PM
  #5
The struggle I am dealing with is I don't know who I am. I can see from articles that I have a lot of traits of narcissism. It is very painful to realize that you are self absorbed, have little to no empathy, and no longer receive joy from the things you use to or understand the purpose or motivation for your life.
I can't forgive my mother for my childhood even though I can tell myself don't blame her because maybe she only did what she knew to do because that's all she was taught. I see myself in her and I don't want to be her. Easter Sunday was not the best because I rarely spend time with her anymore since I can only tolerate small doses of her guilt trips and control and whining about situations that she creates. It has been suggested that I work things out with her, but we have 2 different views of my childhood. How do you work something out with someone who won't hold a mirror up to themselves? So am I avoiding the issues or Do I learn to forgive her and move on?

That's just a good place to start since it was so recent and since I think a lot of my problems stem from my childhood.

Thanks for asking 'here today'
smlawnz is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
here today
Grand Magnate
here today has no updates.
 
Member Since: Jun 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 3,515
10 yr Member
1,429 hugs
given
PC PoohBah!
Default Apr 04, 2018 at 10:17 PM
  #6
I can definitely identify with not knowing who I am. I may be I'm getting better, sort of. But it's taken a long time

Therapy has helped me to know myself better. But it's a very mixed bag because it has also led me to additional confusion about myself, too.

The people who trash-talk narcissists are, I think, insecure people themselves. Which may be part of the reason that bashing narcissists is gratifying to them. I'm definitely not trying to bash them! Just that they are invested in what they are saying because it's satisfying to them somehow.

I said I would offer some feedback so here it is: I think there's a difference between being self-absorbed and a being a narcissist. And the public at large and the trash-talkers may not really understand that.

There are some people diagnosed with NPD who have posted in this forum, and I have appreciated them and liked them and learned from them. And I don't think that you are one of them. I could be wrong. But have you ever been given a diagnosis of NPD?

Lack of identity -- yeah. I have that and I think a lot of people with any personality disorder can have that. Maybe you don't even need to have a personality disorder. A big problem, no question. At least it has been for me.

Your relationship with your mom. Ignore, if it doesn't feel right to you, what other people suggest that you do.

I'm currently going to meetings of Adult Children of Alcoholics and Dysfunctional Families meetings. Sounds like your family was dysfunctional, too? If you haven't heard of or looked into that organization, it might be worth a checking out as a possibility.

Hope this helps some. At least maybe it's a little different from what you were reading on Quora.
here today is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
 
Thanks for this!
Atypical_Disaster
smlawnz
New Member
smlawnz has no updates.
 
Member Since: Dec 2016
Location: VA
Posts: 9
5 yr Member
1 hugs
given
Default Apr 05, 2018 at 07:14 AM
  #7
I haven't been diagnosed with anything other than depression and being codependent. Have dealt with panic attacks, agoraphobia, social anxiety, a narcopath stalker ex boyfriend which caused some ptsd.

My appointment Monday, is for me, to see if this therapist is the one that will work with me or if she will refer me to another. I haven't been ready to admit my flaws and I think I am ready for a therapist who will give it to me straight.

Seeing the discussions on Quora about Narcissists, Covert especially, I have been able to see some of my traits I want to correct, but I don't know how.

Ignorance was bliss, now I see things differently.
smlawnz is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
here today
Grand Magnate
here today has no updates.
 
Member Since: Jun 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 3,515
10 yr Member
1,429 hugs
given
PC PoohBah!
Default Apr 05, 2018 at 09:33 AM
  #8
Good luck. I'm more codepenent than directly narcissisist, too. But there is that covert aspect to it.
here today is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
-jimi-
Jimi the rat
 
-jimi-'s Avatar
-jimi- is a vermin. Please feed me anyway.
 
Member Since: Dec 2008
Location: Northern Europe
Posts: 6,234
15 yr Member PC PoohBah!
Default Apr 05, 2018 at 09:52 AM
  #9
If you want to see some bad stuff about NPD you don't have to leave here, lots of "articles" about how non human NPD people are...

__________________
-jimi- is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
 
Thanks for this!
Atypical_Disaster
here today
Grand Magnate
here today has no updates.
 
Member Since: Jun 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 3,515
10 yr Member
1,429 hugs
given
PC PoohBah!
Default Apr 05, 2018 at 10:37 AM
  #10
Quote:
Originally Posted by -jimi- View Post
If you want to see some bad stuff about NPD you don't have to leave here, lots of "articles" about how non human NPD people are...
I think the person came to this specific forum to see if there was anybody who thought that NPD people were human. Novel idea, that, I agree.

Plenty of stuff on PC I agree, sometimes even in this forum, that seem to claim they aren't.
here today is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
 
Thanks for this!
Atypical_Disaster
Anonymous55397
Guest
Anonymous55397 has no updates. Edit
 
Posts: n/a
Default Apr 05, 2018 at 10:37 AM
  #11
Quote:
Originally Posted by -jimi- View Post
If you want to see some bad stuff about NPD you don't have to leave here, lots of "articles" about how non human NPD people are...
I was thinking that as well. Lots of PC articles are about NPD - it seems to be a very trendy topic these days.

I have also noticed that people tend to label abusive individuals with NPD straight away even if they don't necessarily meet the criteria. Throwing around the term "narcissistic ex" has never been more in fashion than right now.

I find it a little odd considering this is a support site that has a sub-forum for individuals with NPD.
  Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
 
Thanks for this!
Atypical_Disaster, here today
Steiger
Member
 
Steiger's Avatar
Steiger wields the Sceptre of Kings
 
Member Since: Jan 2018
Location: Hood
Posts: 121
5 yr Member
14 hugs
given
Default Apr 06, 2018 at 11:39 AM
  #12
Quote:
Originally Posted by smlawnz View Post
All I see on Quora is how pitiful of an excuse for a human being Narcissists are. I asked if there were any conversations that didn't make us out to be baby eating ax murderers. Boy what a mistake!!

I am just so hurt by coming to the realization of who and what I am. I didn't choose not to have been given the opportunities in childhood that others got. I don't want to hurt the people around me. I don't know how to be anything other that what I am. I don't know how to fix myself. Even when you read articles by therapists they disagree on if you can even treat a narcissist.

I'm just looking for help. I am ready to admit my flaws. I want to change. I can not keep living my life this way. I don't mean anybody any harm, I don't think I am even aware of the things that I do or what the true meaning of those things are to others.

I just want to get better.
I wouldn't get all worked up about what other people say or write about. We are hardwired differently. It's natural for neurotypicals to fear the unknown, especially when it commonly takes on a dark flavor. We are capable of things they are not. Sometimes they see it as an unfair advantage over them. The drive to be better is what should be focused on here, for with it and enough dedication, we can get very close to perfection.
Steiger is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
 
Thanks for this!
smlawnz
Steiger
Member
 
Steiger's Avatar
Steiger wields the Sceptre of Kings
 
Member Since: Jan 2018
Location: Hood
Posts: 121
5 yr Member
14 hugs
given
Default Apr 06, 2018 at 11:43 AM
  #13
Becoming self aware is what increasingly gives us control over our subconscious drives. We can control ourselves with our rational brain, using the subconscious drives as fuel. It's a matter of giving the drive a worthwhile goal.
Steiger is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
 
Thanks for this!
mwaxy
smlawnz
New Member
smlawnz has no updates.
 
Member Since: Dec 2016
Location: VA
Posts: 9
5 yr Member
1 hugs
given
Default Apr 07, 2018 at 07:02 AM
  #14
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steiger View Post
Becoming self aware is what increasingly gives us control over our subconscious drives. We can control ourselves with our rational brain, using the subconscious drives as fuel. It's a matter of giving the drive a worthwhile goal.
I like that 'Becoming Self Aware'.
smlawnz is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
tr808
New Member
tr808 has no updates.
 
Member Since: Jun 2018
Location: USA
Posts: 1
5 yr Member
Default Jun 23, 2018 at 02:23 PM
  #15
Whew, am I glad to see you guys.

A little background:
I have not been formally diagnosed as having NPD. I've gone to therapy and taken meds for depression, dysthymia, on and off for about 20 years, so have been forever researching "quirks" in behavior and trouble dealing with the world/life.

But it wasn't until I had a boyfriend-turned-friend who I am positive has NPD was I able to observe the patterns up-close. As time went on, I realized that the more I learned about his behavior, the more I could see those same traits in my own life, things that pre-dated this person. It was a safe place to do my research, because we had only "dated" for about 1.5-2 years, and were just friends after that, for going on 7 years. It's safe because I stopped being sucked in by his drama a long time ago. Where I used to take everything so personally and become hysterical, now I just kind of either roll my eyes and/or think, "This is so predictable. And so interesting."

The whole time, things have felt like they've improved. Over the years, his ridiculousness has lessened, and I'd say 40% of the time, he's a great friend, 40% he's a good friend, and 20%, he's an outrageous, immature, selfish, pouting, manipulative, silent-treatment-y, ridiculous, pretentious prick.

But I could never deny the 40% figures. And despite what the articles always say, I am convinced that the 40% great friend is not just an act to keep me in rotation. He's genuinely been there for me through some really tough experiences. We haven't lived in the same city for 8 years, and sometimes it's just good to connect with someone who's removed from your everyday life, but who you know cares about you. And I do believe he cares, despite his sometimes horrible behavior.

On a scale from 1-10 with 10 being really clinically bad NPD, I'd say my friend is an 8 or a 9, and I'm about a 5 or 6 -? Obviously not very scientific, any of this, but you get the point.

Anyway, thanks to that experience, I've over time realized: this is me, too. And I realized that part of the reason I've stayed friends with this person, is because I believe there is someone in there, someone beyond the narcissism. And I know there's someone inside me, too, who wants to be better, but has no idea how because it feels so ingrained to do things the way I've been doing.

Right now:
I've come to realize that I actually don't think I know what it means to love another person. I don't mean romantically, although certainly that, too. But how to keep caring. I do a LOT of splitting -- with my dad, siblings, friends (of which I do not have a ton, but a handful of good ones), coworkers... pretty much anyone and everyone in my life. I feel much more empathy towards complete strangers and most especially towards animals and nature.

But I know there's someone inside me who is a real person and who wants to change and stop getting mad at people for not doing what I want them to do, and immediately judging people in my mind as ignorant and provincial vs super intelligent and worthwhile. I've never respected any authority figure no matter who they are, even if I know nothing about their field, I will find in my mind a way that I am smarter than them anyway; I will find a flaw in them where I still win. It doesn't matter who they are. I could be talking to the top neuroscientist or economist and think, "Hmm...he's not very good at presenting his ideas," or "Well, I guess that's one possible explanation..." I have this chip on my shoulder that tells me I'm being cleverly skeptical, but I'm really just putting everyone else in the "not as good as me" box. I see most people as weak in one way or another, and me as some kind of all-knowing person who truly understands the rhythm of the universe and how nature works.

Oh, and god forbid people should criticize me. Whatever it is, however they say it, they're almost certainly wrong, unless it's something irrefutable, like, "Hey you just put your right shoe on your left foot," or "The movie starts at 8, not 9."

I can hold a grudge for a veeeery long time, and even though on a conscious level I know I'm SUPPOSED to think that's a bad thing, if I'm honest, I know I don't actually believe that. It's like... I know what a "good person" who's not manipulative is supposed to look like and act like, but when I try to do that, it feels so fake, like I'm just imitating others or following a "human being" script.

In the meantime, my life is a mess, I'm nowhere near living up to my potential, I go running to the very people I treat like crap when I'm lonely or sad, always wanting to get my needs met RIGHT NOW... I know I'm doing it, but like I said, it doesn't feel like acting differently would be real, and I don't want to go through life being a robot. But things aren't any better this way, because I often find myself alone (shocker). So what to do?

Anyway, yes, I've read all the books and articles about "us." But how are we supposed to improve if even people in the medical community are like, "Nope. No chance. Can't change. Cut them off."? And that can't possibly be true. Fifty years ago, that's what people thought about people with autism, and 100 years ago, about people with Down Syndrome -- put 'em in a home and they'll be happy there, because they can't function out here. There are people with Down Syndrome who get jobs and pay taxes and get married and have kids!!!!

I am starting to see some literature about narcissists getting better, but it's slow going. I've tried looking for a support group, but they're always for alcoholics and addicts. In a way, yes, we are sort of like addicts in the sense that we're addicted to bad behavior patterns that in the end are no good for us, but still, I don't want to show up at a meeting of a bunch of people trying to kick meth and be like, "Hi! My name is so-and-so, and I think I might be a narcissist. Mind if I join you?" Uh. No. So I'm still searching.

This article is more sympathetic and has some good ways to recognize your behavior:
"Are You a Narcissist? 6 Sure Signs of Narcissism" Psychology today (I can't post links yet because I'm new)

and this article is really good:
"Help! I'm a narcissist!" on the page The Narcissistic Continuum

I like to think that this gigantic post is not my narcissism in full force, but just an effort to explain the whole story. Hopefully you guys won't judge me
tr808 is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
 
Hugs from:
unaluna
 
Thanks for this!
here today, SparkySmart
Steiger
Member
 
Steiger's Avatar
Steiger wields the Sceptre of Kings
 
Member Since: Jan 2018
Location: Hood
Posts: 121
5 yr Member
14 hugs
given
Default Jun 24, 2018 at 07:41 AM
  #16
Quote:
Originally Posted by tr808 View Post
Whew, am I glad to see you guys.

A little background:
I have not been formally diagnosed as having NPD. I've gone to therapy and taken meds for depression, dysthymia, on and off for about 20 years, so have been forever researching "quirks" in behavior and trouble dealing with the world/life.

But it wasn't until I had a boyfriend-turned-friend who I am positive has NPD was I able to observe the patterns up-close. As time went on, I realized that the more I learned about his behavior, the more I could see those same traits in my own life, things that pre-dated this person. It was a safe place to do my research, because we had only "dated" for about 1.5-2 years, and were just friends after that, for going on 7 years. It's safe because I stopped being sucked in by his drama a long time ago. Where I used to take everything so personally and become hysterical, now I just kind of either roll my eyes and/or think, "This is so predictable. And so interesting."

The whole time, things have felt like they've improved. Over the years, his ridiculousness has lessened, and I'd say 40% of the time, he's a great friend, 40% he's a good friend, and 20%, he's an outrageous, immature, selfish, pouting, manipulative, silent-treatment-y, ridiculous, pretentious prick.

But I could never deny the 40% figures. And despite what the articles always say, I am convinced that the 40% great friend is not just an act to keep me in rotation. He's genuinely been there for me through some really tough experiences. We haven't lived in the same city for 8 years, and sometimes it's just good to connect with someone who's removed from your everyday life, but who you know cares about you. And I do believe he cares, despite his sometimes horrible behavior.

On a scale from 1-10 with 10 being really clinically bad NPD, I'd say my friend is an 8 or a 9, and I'm about a 5 or 6 -? Obviously not very scientific, any of this, but you get the point.

Anyway, thanks to that experience, I've over time realized: this is me, too. And I realized that part of the reason I've stayed friends with this person, is because I believe there is someone in there, someone beyond the narcissism. And I know there's someone inside me, too, who wants to be better, but has no idea how because it feels so ingrained to do things the way I've been doing.

Right now:
I've come to realize that I actually don't think I know what it means to love another person. I don't mean romantically, although certainly that, too. But how to keep caring. I do a LOT of splitting -- with my dad, siblings, friends (of which I do not have a ton, but a handful of good ones), coworkers... pretty much anyone and everyone in my life. I feel much more empathy towards complete strangers and most especially towards animals and nature.

But I know there's someone inside me who is a real person and who wants to change and stop getting mad at people for not doing what I want them to do, and immediately judging people in my mind as ignorant and provincial vs super intelligent and worthwhile. I've never respected any authority figure no matter who they are, even if I know nothing about their field, I will find in my mind a way that I am smarter than them anyway; I will find a flaw in them where I still win. It doesn't matter who they are. I could be talking to the top neuroscientist or economist and think, "Hmm...he's not very good at presenting his ideas," or "Well, I guess that's one possible explanation..." I have this chip on my shoulder that tells me I'm being cleverly skeptical, but I'm really just putting everyone else in the "not as good as me" box. I see most people as weak in one way or another, and me as some kind of all-knowing person who truly understands the rhythm of the universe and how nature works.

Oh, and god forbid people should criticize me. Whatever it is, however they say it, they're almost certainly wrong, unless it's something irrefutable, like, "Hey you just put your right shoe on your left foot," or "The movie starts at 8, not 9."

I can hold a grudge for a veeeery long time, and even though on a conscious level I know I'm SUPPOSED to think that's a bad thing, if I'm honest, I know I don't actually believe that. It's like... I know what a "good person" who's not manipulative is supposed to look like and act like, but when I try to do that, it feels so fake, like I'm just imitating others or following a "human being" script.

In the meantime, my life is a mess, I'm nowhere near living up to my potential, I go running to the very people I treat like crap when I'm lonely or sad, always wanting to get my needs met RIGHT NOW... I know I'm doing it, but like I said, it doesn't feel like acting differently would be real, and I don't want to go through life being a robot. But things aren't any better this way, because I often find myself alone (shocker). So what to do?

Anyway, yes, I've read all the books and articles about "us." But how are we supposed to improve if even people in the medical community are like, "Nope. No chance. Can't change. Cut them off."? And that can't possibly be true. Fifty years ago, that's what people thought about people with autism, and 100 years ago, about people with Down Syndrome -- put 'em in a home and they'll be happy there, because they can't function out here. There are people with Down Syndrome who get jobs and pay taxes and get married and have kids!!!!

I am starting to see some literature about narcissists getting better, but it's slow going. I've tried looking for a support group, but they're always for alcoholics and addicts. In a way, yes, we are sort of like addicts in the sense that we're addicted to bad behavior patterns that in the end are no good for us, but still, I don't want to show up at a meeting of a bunch of people trying to kick meth and be like, "Hi! My name is so-and-so, and I think I might be a narcissist. Mind if I join you?" Uh. No. So I'm still searching.

This article is more sympathetic and has some good ways to recognize your behavior:
"Are You a Narcissist? 6 Sure Signs of Narcissism" Psychology today (I can't post links yet because I'm new)

and this article is really good:
"Help! I'm a narcissist!" on the page The Narcissistic Continuum

I like to think that this gigantic post is not my narcissism in full force, but just an effort to explain the whole story. Hopefully you guys won't judge me

No judgements here. There is always a way to change mental habits and neural pathways with better habits, discipline, reflection, and understanding, as well as neurochemistry levels through diet and exercise. That's the long, and hard way. But it's the most genuine and long lasting. But nobody wants to hear that *****! They want an easy button. I don't have one. I have to learn the hard way, so that's what I do. There is a lot involved so if you feel like chatting more about it you can pm me, if not, good luck.
Steiger is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
here today
Grand Magnate
here today has no updates.
 
Member Since: Jun 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 3,515
10 yr Member
1,429 hugs
given
PC PoohBah!
Default Jun 24, 2018 at 09:01 AM
  #17
Quote:
Originally Posted by tr808 View Post
. . .
I like to think that this gigantic post is not my narcissism in full force, but just an effort to explain the whole story. Hopefully you guys won't judge me
Very glad to see your post.

I don't have NPD but a therapist told me I was "narcissistically wounded and fragmented" 8 years ago and did diagnose me with PDNOS.

Long before then I had come across the topic of shame and narcissism in some books I read, trying to find out for myself what might be "wrong" with me.

In the world, I'm probably more codependent and covert narcissistic than overt -- but there is an overt narcissist inside, which I feared and hated and was ashamed of -- and also tried very hard, after seeing stuff in the books, to get in touch with.

For me, it's like I could be "all about you" -- conscientious, "good", and codependent but false -- or "all about me".

I think I'm doing better at developing a perspective that includes both "you" and me, but it's something I figured out myself that I needed -- and how to do it, keeping differing perspectives in mind at one time, is not anything that I could tell anybody else how to do. It may be different for each person.

I can understand your interest in your friend, as he may exhibit something that you know is like you, but other people don't get. A way to learn to understand it, as you have done. (I've done it hanging out in this forum. )

There's the current social judgment against narcissists, and narcissism generally, and then there's the abstract clinical psychology concept, which I think has some merit -- but the theory is far from being really "scientific". Most of what I see in internet research is the therapists socially dissing the people with NPD and related conditions, whom they don't know how to "help" even when they show up on their doorsteps. There's notmuch real thought and research about what is going on with us people and what is needed to "change". (Perhaps you can believe me that with my overt, conscientious, "good" adaptation I had plenty of motivation, and many years of mostly worthless, ineffective, and sometimes harmful therapy.) Maybe it's going on in the more technical journals that I don't have access to, but I kind of doubt it.

I'd be interested in hearing some more about your experience, of your friend and yourself, if you want to write about it. Thanks for posting.
here today is offline   Reply With QuoteReply With Quote
All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:15 AM.
Powered by vBulletin® — Copyright © 2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.



 

My Support Forums

My Support Forums is the online community that was originally begun as the Psych Central Forums in 2001. It now runs as an independent self-help support group community for mental health, personality, and psychological issues and is overseen by a group of dedicated, caring volunteers from around the world.

 

Helplines and Lifelines

The material on this site is for informational purposes only, and is not a substitute for medical advice, diagnosis or treatment provided by a qualified health care provider.

Always consult your doctor or mental health professional before trying anything you read here.