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Confused Jul 21, 2020 at 10:29 PM
  #1
Hello all,

I'm hoping to get a fresh perspective on my parents situation with our puppy. He's seven months, and quite frankly, he's not a good fit for our family. He's a Border Collie/Texas Blue Heeler mix, AKA, two working breeds, and my parents got him based on an unusually calm trait in a normally hyperactive breed they saw in a friend's dog. He's a working breed. He has nothing but energy. My parents want a mellow lap dog. My mom had plainly said, "I don't walk him because I'm lazy and I don't feel like it."

My mom is the trainer of the family, my dad is the one who takes him for walks, and I am the babysitter who walks and plays with him and feed him when my parents go out for the day (which is often).

My parents don't see the reality: He'll never be a mellow dog, and he's not bred to be a couch potato. My parents are couch potatoes, and they are constantly yelling and shouting at the dog every thirty seconds for being the hyperactive working breed he is.

They have absolutely no intention of giving him away. End of subject. Not a question. And that's not to say they aren't loving dog owners or bad dog owners. They absolutely love the dog, would do anything and I mean anything and everything for him but they get frustrated with the work that goes into training him and caring for him.

I get mad, too, because I feel I pick up so much slack. There's been times that I'm swamped with homework and without warning, my parents say, "Here you go, here's the dog, take him out for potty breaks and if you can, take him for a walk and feed him at a certain time, we need to get out" and it completely disrupts schoolwork. They're not doing that as much, but I feel overwhelmed with how often I am asked to care for the dog without a prior agreement.

And there's moments like today, I realize Doc needs me to step up to the plate, if I wasn't tied down with school. I also don't have the money to care for a dog, but I feel we have a very special connection, like he was meant for me. I have been worried about this since before we got the dog, that Mom and Dad gets frustrated and I take over caring for him.

But what should I do? I care a lot about Doc, and I know my parents won't give him up because they truly do care a lot about this dog. I'm more angry at my parents for choosing a highly active breed with the hope he'll be a mellow couch potato. But he's not, and I feel the need to do something and step up to the plate even though he is not my responsibility.

What should I do?
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Default Jul 22, 2020 at 06:47 AM
  #2
This reminds me of situations where a person marries someone believing they will change. Change doesn't happen and everyone is miserable. Seems to me both of your parents are being selfish and irresponsible. They brought him home, but don't take responsibility for him.

My first suggestion was going to rehome him some place where he could burn off some energy. That's a nonstarter.

Do you have a fenced yard where he could run around? Or maybe trips to a dog park to run with other dogs?

If he's not neutered get that done.

You said he's 7 months old. He is still a baby. He needs someone i.e. your parents to take responsibility for his training. He is a combination of two working breeds. If humans don't give him a job, he is going to create one for himself.

Is there a way you could discuss the situation with your parents, pointing out current circumstances are not fair to you or Doc? I remember you had to prove you would be responsible before you got Evie. They need to step up to the plate.

Good luck to you.
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Default Jul 22, 2020 at 12:10 PM
  #3
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Originally Posted by lizardlady View Post

Is there a way you could discuss the situation with your parents, pointing out current circumstances are not fair to you or Doc? I remember you had to prove you would be responsible before you got Evie. They need to step up to the plate.

Good luck to you.
My parents are impossible to communicate with, and I can't talk to them about anything without them blowing up in my face about it. But yes, you make a big point. I worked my butt off to prove myself responsible and I stepped up to the plate for my cat...they can't be lazy about it because "they don't feel like it".
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Default Jul 22, 2020 at 12:26 PM
  #4
My parents ignore the fact that he's a working dog. I remind them, even yesterday, when my mom complained of his uncontrollable energy, that he is a working breed. She threw her hands up and said, "Woop de doo, he's got to get with the program."

I feel forced to take on the extra resposibility, and I'm really resenting it. They told me repeatedly, "You are not mentally fit for a dog, you are not responsible enough for a dog, you do not have what it takes to care for a dog" yet I'm the babysitter, the dog walker, the playmate. My mom saw me playing with him after his walk, which I have not done in a long while, and she says, "See, he gets enough attention" while she spends most of her time barking at him to leave her alone.

It's so frustrating. It's not my responsibility to pick up the slack, yet I feel compelled to because I feel sorry for the dog.
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Default Jul 22, 2020 at 01:06 PM
  #5
He's not going to "get with the program" He is doing what he is genetically programmed to do. Sorry, don't mean to take it out on you. People not taking care of their critters is a hot button for me. Shame on both your parents for being irresponsible. Pets are a many years long responsibility. "I don't feel like it" strikes me as the response of a bratty kid, not a so called adult. Again, sorry. Not angry with you. Angry with your parents' behavior. Wanting a young dog of two hyperactive breeds to "get with the program" is liking wanting a hungry human infant to stop crying because the "adult" in the room is too lazy to get off their butt and feed the poor thing.

Lark, thank you for stepping up and caring for Doc. I know you have too much on your plate as it is. Thanks for caring for Doc. I remember how hard you worked to prove you could care for Evie. Their comments to you about you not being capable of caring for a dog are bitterly ironic.

Would your parents be willing to pay someone to come in and help Doc burn off some energy? You could frame it in terms of training him.

FWIW, my BG has a perpetual motion machine until the last year. He is what we call a "ketchup dog" -Heinz 57 mix breed. Those times his high energy got on my nerves I reminded myself that was part of what appealed to me. Can't be mad at the dog for being what I wanted. Anyway, he just turned 7 and started to slow down some in the last year. So you can look forward to Doc eventually slowing down!
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Default Jul 22, 2020 at 01:37 PM
  #6
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Originally Posted by lizardlady View Post


Lark, thank you for stepping up and caring for Doc. I know you have too much on your plate as it is. Thanks for caring for Doc. I remember how hard you worked to prove you could care for Evie. Their comments to you about you not being capable of caring for a dog are bitterly ironic.

Would your parents be willing to pay someone to come in and help Doc burn off some energy? You could frame it in terms of training him.
Thank you, LL. I just don't know how far this is going to lead to if I start picking up more and more slack.

Doc and I have a very special connection. I see myself and him walking and interacting the way Cesar Millan wrote about in his books as the ideal relationship between owner and dog...I read a lot of dog books, most by Cesar Millan, to prepare for the puppy. Cesar talks a lot about energy and nonverbal communication--and we have that. The past two walks we had, we moved as one unit with very little spoken commands, he just knew by my energy and simple tugs on the leash how he needed to behave. And with my parents in the house, he's rambunctious and running around like a maniac getting into trouble, but when he's alone with me, he's quiet and still and obedient.

I worry that I'll eventually take over the dog, but is that really a bad thing? If my picking up the slack and my parents see how we interact may make them see he is a better fit with me, but I do not have the financial ability of taking care of a dog and I need to focus on graduating next June. So I feel at a loss as to what to do.
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Default Jul 22, 2020 at 01:55 PM
  #7
Just want to give you some tips, as a border collie owner myself, and the owner of two high energy breeds.

First, he is young, like Lizardlady said, so he is still a puppy with puppy energy. He needs to be trained. Border collies do just fine in apartment homes and with a couple of walks a day, IF they are properly trained and get their brains exercised.

What kind of "training" is your mom doing? Not saying this is you, but a lot of people think yelling a word at a dog a number of times is training, or their training ends at "sit" and there is no real training beyond that. Are you doing reward based training? Clicker training? I'm sorry to put up this red flag, but Cesar Milan is the worst dog trainer on the planet, so I wouldn't go with his stuff. He has no credentials, he was just a tv personality - sort of like the current president. Check out Susan Garret - Wag Nation. Susan is a champion agility dog trainer and world renowned for positive rewards based training. Her program Wag Nation is set up for people with little training expertise and is founded in research. Also Karen Pryor has an extensive free resource library online.

Please, whatever you do, do not follow anything anyone says about dominance theory, alpha dog BS, or that dogs are like wolves. That was all debunked back in the 80s. Simple tugs on the leash are not teaching him anything - and are force plus training, whereas you will have a better relationship and better training results to go with force free. A leash tug merely interrupts a behavior you don't like with a punishment, but he will not make the association for what. Do you reward him after he responds to the leash tug properly? Force plus training has to be done in a very specific way to achieve the outcomes you want. Otherwise you will always be doing the leash tug - and if you always do the leash tug, then the dog isn't trained. He didn't learn anything.

Dogs don't speak or think in English. They do not understand what "no" means. They don't understand "don't do that". They need specific commands that have been associated through exposure to an action, to redirect them. So if you don't want your dog to bark at other dogs, for example, you would train him to do something else - an actual action - when he is in the situation where he wants to bark.

Wag Nation is video based and I think it's like $10 a month. However, Susan Garrett has numerous blogs and free videos on training that can show you how to train Doc to behave the way you want him to.

I hope this helps. I think you have it in you to train Doc - border collies and heelers are super smart and they want to use their brains. And through training, you will grow closer to him and have those close bond you want.

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Default Jul 22, 2020 at 01:57 PM
  #8
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Originally Posted by lizardlady View Post

FWIW, my BG has a perpetual motion machine until the last year. He is what we call a "ketchup dog" -Heinz 57 mix breed. Those times his high energy got on my nerves I reminded myself that was part of what appealed to me. Can't be mad at the dog for being what I wanted. Anyway, he just turned 7 and started to slow down some in the last year. So you can look forward to Doc eventually slowing down!
Agree with everything you said and just wanted to add: Astro, my border collie, is almost 12, and he still competes in agility, he still outruns the younger dogs at the park, he still plays ball and frisbee relentlessly. He has more energy than his 2 year old brother.

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Default Jul 22, 2020 at 07:24 PM
  #9
Oh Beeg still tears around the farm like a maniac, just not as long as when he was younger. If I were younger I'd love to do agility with him. My poor, beat up old body couldn't do it though.

Thanks for the comments about Cesar Milan. His methods strike me as borderline abusive. When training/teaching one of my critters I come from the perspective that we are partners, not that I'm the dominant one.
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Default Jul 22, 2020 at 07:30 PM
  #10
Seesaw mentioned keeping Doc's brain busy. I wonder about providing him with toys that engage his brain. I've seen toys that the dog has to solve a puzzle to get a treat.

Lark, I believe our furry family members pick who "their" person in the family is. Sounds like Doc is bonded with you. Your parents might have bough thg him and brought him home, but he is your dog and you are his person.
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Default Jul 22, 2020 at 09:34 PM
  #11
What I am asking is not how to train the dog or the speculation of Cesar Millan's credentials. I need to know what line I draw on with my involvement with the dog. My mom, a mere five minutes ago, slammed the door on me--my own bedroom door--because I allowed the dog into my room and grab a piece of plastic from my trash bin, and I did nothing to stop it. I am tired of taking responsibility for a dog I was denied for being "mentally unfit" for puppy raising, and yet I am going out of my way to take care of the dog MY WAY when I should not at all be this involved. I am fed up and I don't know what to do.
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Default Jul 22, 2020 at 10:25 PM
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What I am asking is not how to train the dog or the speculation of Cesar Millan's credentials. I need to know what line I draw on with my involvement with the dog. My mom, a mere five minutes ago, slammed the door on me--my own bedroom door--because I allowed the dog into my room and grab a piece of plastic from my trash bin, and I did nothing to stop it. I am tired of taking responsibility for a dog I was denied for being "mentally unfit" for puppy raising, and yet I am going out of my way to take care of the dog MY WAY when I should not at all be this involved. I am fed up and I don't know what to do.
I'm sorry, LL, I went straight to "LL needs this dog and she can have this great relationship" I skipped over what your real question was. I apologize for that.

I'm torn because you are aware the dog needs help and care, and your parents arent taking care of him. At the same time I dont think you should be picking up for their slack and not taking care of him.

Um, where did they get Doc? Could you notify the rescue or breeder of the issue? A lot of rescues or breeders will intervene if this is an issue.

Definitely you have to put your foot down. I would stop short of anything beyond basic care. If the dog is driving them crazy, maybe let him drive them crazy until they realize he needs a home where he will be happy?

Unfortunately not training or exercising a dog (unless it's causing severe obesity) isnt really considered abuse or even neglect.

I know how hard it is to put your foot down though, when you clearly care and want the best for him. Maybe this isnt the best idea, but can you find him a new home without telling them? I know that idea will get a lot of resistance, but...well, you know the situation.

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Meds I've tried: Prozac, Zoloft, Celexa, Effexor, Remeron, Elavil, Wellbutrin, Risperidone, Abilify, Prazosin, Paxil, Trazadone, Tramadol, Topomax, Xanax, Propranolol, Valium, Visteril, Vraylar, Selinor, Clonopin, Ambien

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Default Jul 22, 2020 at 11:01 PM
  #13
Thank you, Seesaw.

I called my grandparents and after a bit of some rambling, I was able to tell them of my frustrations. They told me the dog, although a family dog, is my parent's responsibility, not mine, and I am putting too much on my shoulders to take care of this dog. My mom left me a scathing text for not emptying the cat box, though I am sure I emptied it two days ago...well, it was full, and my parents were mad about it, thus I called my grandparents in my frustration. They said stop and think about it for a second, yes, it's my responsibility to empty out the catbox, but it's my parents job to raise the dog, and it is my job to focus on my studies. They said if I want the dog with me when my parents are gone, or if I want to take him on walks because I want to, and not just an expectation, feel free, but ultimately, its my parents job and they will take care of the dog...it shouldn't be an added stress to pitch in when its not expected of me.

It's been a fear of mine from the beginning that a working breed will be too much for my parents, and a fear of mine is that I will have an extra responsibility over my head. I do not think this is the case, but it raises my anxiety that the dog is not given walks every day, or that there is a constant "DocDocDocDocDocDoc" all day long, but I think everything will work itself out.
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Default Jul 22, 2020 at 11:08 PM
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Thank you, Seesaw.


I called my grandparents and after a bit of some rambling, I was able to tell them of my frustrations. They told me the dog, although a family dog, is my parent's responsibility, not mine, and I am putting too much on my shoulders to take care of this dog. My mom left me a scathing text for not emptying the cat box, though I am sure I emptied it two days ago...well, it was full, and my parents were mad about it, thus I called my grandparents in my frustration. They said stop and think about it for a second, yes, it's my responsibility to empty out the catbox, but it's my parents job to raise the dog, and it is my job to focus on my studies. They said if I want the dog with me when my parents are gone, or if I want to take him on walks because I want to, and not just an expectation, feel free, but ultimately, its my parents job and they will take care of the dog...it shouldn't be an added stress to pitch in when its not expected of me.


It's been a fear of mine from the beginning that a working breed will be too much for my parents, and a fear of mine is that I will have an extra responsibility over my head. I do not think this is the case, but it raises my anxiety that the dog is not given walks every day, or that there is a constant "DocDocDocDocDocDoc" all day long, but I think everything will work itself out.
I'm not sure how many dogs you've had since puppihood either. Just am FYI, when I got Astro, I literally thought he was going to die every day because I'd forget to do something. Doc will be alright if you push his care back on your parents. He might be a little stir crazy, but he is your parents responsibility. Your grandparents are right, your job is your studies and whatever chores you've agreed to.

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What if I fall? Oh, my dear, but what if you fly?

Primary Dx: C-PTSD and Severe Chronic Treatment Resistant Major Depressive Disorder
Secondary Dx: Generalized Anxiety Disorder with mild Agoraphobia.

Meds I've tried: Prozac, Zoloft, Celexa, Effexor, Remeron, Elavil, Wellbutrin, Risperidone, Abilify, Prazosin, Paxil, Trazadone, Tramadol, Topomax, Xanax, Propranolol, Valium, Visteril, Vraylar, Selinor, Clonopin, Ambien

Treatments I've done: CBT, DBT, Transcranial Magnetic Stimulation (TMS), Talk therapy, psychotherapy, exercise, diet, sleeping more, sleeping less...
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Default Jul 23, 2020 at 09:01 PM
  #15
Does Doc sleep with your parents?

I agree with the idea of food puzzles, toys like a Manners Minder and a Snuffle Mat, that will help Doc stay busy by himself. Would they possibly hire a dog walker to take him on a big hike daily? Tiring out this mix on a lead when young seems next to impossible. There's a doggie tread mill called a Dog Pacer. Some dogs really like them. The agility website Clean Run has some very cool educational toys for busy dogs. Could your mom take Doc to obedience classes?

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Default Jul 24, 2020 at 03:15 PM
  #16
My parents bought a doggie puzzle and she watches training videos for obedience. No in person classes because of covid. Its starting to look like a weekly thing but for the past two Fridays she takes Doc to a doggie day care to play with other dogs. It defnitely wears him out. He has a lot of toys and me and mom play with him every day. We try rotating dog walking. One of the setbacks for my mom is she has a bad ankle and a bad knee so its hard on her body to walk him so thats why we try to rotate and also because we need him to respond to and and be obedient to each of us and not just to one walker
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Default Jul 24, 2020 at 03:16 PM
  #17
I guess I feel a little like seesaw with the constant worrying of "is he gonna be okay? Are we going to lose him? Are we doing enough?"
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