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saminsf88
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Default Feb 13, 2015 at 04:31 AM
  #1
Hi all,

I'm not really sure where to begin explaining the situation my "friend" is dealing with, since it may take quite a while. This is something that he has dealt with his entire life but have never felt comfortable discussing it with others, and it is something that even scares himself to think about in depth. He is a 26-year old, white male with a b.s. in business marketing and currently looking into graduate school. Now before I go any furtherer, I want to explain that by no means do I think I am in any position to self-diagnose, but this is something I have looked into extensively and is highly concerning. One of the reasons it is so alarming, is because it has affected his life in such an essential way, and it has done so without him even realizing what was the root cause of his peculiar behavior. Also, he doesn't look like this "type" of person. People would describe him as attractive, easy-going, nice, all of those positive types of things, when in reality it is a facade. Please understand this is not something easy for me to talk about. Thank you.

Quick background on my friend:
-He was born into a middle-class working family and was raised among peers in the upper-class
-Showed great signs of hyper-NPD as a child and adolescent
-Had very few violent episodes as a child but when they did occur, he would get physical
-Wet the bed until age 13
-By age 14, essentially every male role model in his life died (father, uncles, grandfathers) therefore raised by all women since puberty
-Age 15, two good friends commit suicide, begin involved in selling drugs
-Theft (started stealing from stores by age 10, breaking into homes by age 15)
-Arrested 4 times as a juvenile by age 16
-Extreme pathological lying (developing new identities/multiple fake lives)
-Sabotaged and manipulated relationships with females severely only for self-serving purposes
-Derives extreme pleasure from emotionally hurting female romantic partners
-Unable to hold a job, long periods of inactivity and a very parasitic lifestyle

Now, based on this very broad overview, what should a person in these circumstances do? What is your opinion? Feel free to ask any other questions please
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Default Feb 13, 2015 at 06:01 AM
  #2
Hello and sorry to hear of your challenges. You explain the troubling circumstances of your "friend" (your quotes), but deny any qualification to "self-diagnose", even though you're talking about diagnosing your friend, not yourself. Then you ask what "a person in these circumstances do?" Whose circumstances, yours or his?

Instead of reading "What's someone to do with a young sociopath?", your post title reads "What's a young sociopath to do?"

I'm partial to this suspicion because I usually take pleasure in following an embarrassing or incriminating question with the trite disclaimer "Asking for a friend", so I must ask, are you asking about what to do about a stand-in "friend" or your own personal issues?

There's appreciable ambiguity in your post over who needs advice about who doing what. Since I owe you the respect of a straight answer, if you are indeed your sociopath "friend", then find a therapist with whom you can explore the roots of the history and behavior you described so you can stop damaging yourself and other people. If you're not the friend, watch your back and try not to end up riding shotgun on his long road to ruin.
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Default Feb 13, 2015 at 12:35 PM
  #3
it is also important to understand the difference between "sociopathy" and "psychopathy". sociopathy is a condition that is created by extreme abuse in early childhood, and a failure to bond with caregivers (in general terms). psychopathy is the absence or impairment of glands in the brain which allow certain behaviors, like impulse control.

it sounds to me like you are describing psychopathy, for which there is no cure. the only treatment is behavior modification, and since people with this disorder tend to be highly intelligent and manipulative, behavior modification is very hard to implement. a person with that condition might be able to live by RULES most of the time, unless the environment offers triggering stimuli.

essentially, it is not safe to be casual about any relationship with persons who have either type of dysfunction. wish you the best~~

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Default Feb 13, 2015 at 01:03 PM
  #4
Wow saminsf88. With the exception of a few details tweaked here and there, you almost told my life story. For a moment I was even wondering if I was " your friend" lol. I must agree with Gus1234U about rules and behavior modifications being the most useful practices. From my personal experience, understanding the logical benefits to doing certain socially acceptable actions opposed to socially unacceptable actions has had the largest impact on my premeditated choices. However, it has had virtually no effect on "impulsive circumstances" or need for stimulation.
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Default Feb 13, 2015 at 03:17 PM
  #5
Sorry for the confusion, the post is in regards to myself. I haven't been able to admit directly that I have anything wrong with myself but I find it easier on an internet forum.

@Gus1234U, Great answer. You seem quite knowledgeable in the subject. I agree with the concept of a triggering stimuli. In my high school days, I was a good looking, athletic young boy, but I was extremely anti-social and hyper-narcissistic. Girls were into me, but I lacked the social skill to go anything beyond an innocent kiss. I often felt like I was living a double life. Around girls I was this shy boy during the day, but at night I was this crazed drug using/selling maniac. I would stalk the streets at night until the early hours getting high, selling, or stealing. Perhaps the lack of any role models played a role (at the time I was living alone with my grandmother from age 13-16) I got off on the fact that no one ever suspected me because I was so "innocent" looking. Because of this behavior I missed out on a lot social aspects of high school (never went to prom, never played school sports, etc). After graduation I spent two years lying around smoking marijuana, using pills, drinking alcohol and living a parasitic narcissistic lifestyle. I decided I wanted to go to college as I was around 20 at the time, and live a socially-fulfilling life before I was to grow out of being a young man. The thought of being around many young single girls motivated the "good" part of me to go to junior college and by the next year I was a sophomore at a great university. However, this stimuli is very shallow and superficial, when in reality a normal person would go to college in order to receive an education and obtain a degree and secure a job. This never crossed my mind. In highschool I hadn't even contemplated going to school (lack of long term goals) and rarely showed up for class. But this triggering stimuli, you mentioned, motivated me to apply myself and with ease, I got into a great school, completely abstained from substance abuse (aside from recreational alcohol) and made many many female acquaintances/partners. This is were the extreme manipulation and lack of empathy began to really show.

I was aware of the difference between a psychopath and sociopath, but hesitant to throw around the psychopath term. As I do show essentially every trait on the Hare Checklist, I do not have violent sexual fantasies, I have no hatred for any humans and I wish more than anything to be happy and get married and get a job. But at times, this task seems nearly impossible to even contemplate as I am so accustomed to an implusive antisocial lifestyle. When I was around 14 I had an MRI of my brain performed by two lovely young Stanford graduate students. They greeted me and were extremely friendly and compassionate before beginning. The entire procedure took about 15 minutes, and after it was concluded I went to ask them how my brain looked. I will never forget the completely utter fear I saw in their eyes when they looked at me. I was so young at the time I thought I had done something wrong. The vibe I got was this kid has the brain of a murderer, I could feel it in the room. I then had to ask them if everything was okay? And one of the girls barely managed to say "Yeah, everything's okay", while the other girl just stared shockingly at me. It wasn't until age 24, 10 years later that I realized what they saw, a young psychopathic brain, perhaps for the first time in real life, I will never forget that.

@Redsoxrule

Thanks bud. In your experiences, has the condition continued to manifest itself and grow stronger over time? In my experience this is true. I can go periods of time, going to church, getting a beer with friends, doing well in school or work, followed by longer periods of substance abuse, thieving, assaulting, not showing up to work, just extreme societal norm and rule breaking.

Let's see, in regards to violence:
-no animal abuse (I have been the perpetrator of the demise of small animals as a child but, not entirely on purpose)
-no extreme deviant sexual fantasies
-been in many physical fights and shouting arguments with male strangers
-tried to strangle mother around age 9
-tried to drown another male child age 10
-would fight with friends so often at school they had to set mats out and regulate our fights
-have fantasies about abusing females even to the point of serious injury but never to the point of their demise

Another factor that is very scary is my decision making. I know the difference between right and wrong, obviously, but I consciously make the bad or evil decision every time, without question. The only thing that keeps me from acting on these bad things frequently is the fear of prison time. My condition comes in waves and goes into remission then returns stronger, I believe I am coming back to my senses during 2015 and it feels good, 2013-14 was pretty dark. I have been extremely lucky with law enforcement as an adult, I have avoided the frequent encounters with them I had as a child, and when they do occur I raise little suspicion.

One night I was driving around a big city, extremely high on pills, I saw three attractive blonde girls all alone in need of a ride at around 3:30 am. I made an illegal turn asked the girls if they wanted a ride and they happily got in my car. Soon after an officer pulled me over and witnessed what I had done. He wrote me a ticket for my illegal driving and continued to inform the girls to be safe and that I could be a Charlie Manson type character. His jokes amused me but I flipped the role to make him look like the bad guy and once again the girls saw me as the victim, when in reality they know nothing about me, something I would get pleasure from. I would drive around high at night and pick up girls looking for rides from bars or clubs up on a regular basis, and would regularly get phone numbers, kisses, money, etc. They trusted me based on my innocent looking face/mask alone, very scary (9/10 girls would get in my car without hesitation) My best friend is a psych-major and he is the one who initially informed me and that he has long suspected psychopathology. From my experience, it is absolutely essential for this type of personality (the one who wants to blend in, the high IQ psychopath) that he develops a lifestyle structure that is secure and minimize any factors that may bring about symptoms, which in return lead to actions. I could go on for days about behavior and not to mention the trance like state one experiences once the feeling presents itself. You essentially lose yourself, your identity, maybe the lack of a conscious during this state is why one makes these horrible choices, whatever their outlet may be.

Keep in mind, this is only based off personal experience. I have never studied psychology, nor psychopathy in detail, nor have I ever went to seek help from a professional and this is all from first hand experience.

Last edited by saminsf88; Feb 13, 2015 at 06:29 PM..
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Default Feb 14, 2015 at 07:22 PM
  #6
Saminsf88, like yourself my "condition" has continued to grow as time has went on. Expecially the need for stimulation. I used to get bored very easily as a child, but now I live in what seems like perpetual boredome. However, im only a few months shy of 26 myself, so I'm not sure if it the symptoms will ever decrease or cease to increase. But, some of my anti-social habits have changed or have been integrated into more acceptable habits. I traded substance abuse for more dangerous sports activities. Things like rock climbing, amateur racing, and boxing.I try to have as many adrenaline filled activities as posible. However, they still fail to satiate me. I too can go for short periods of time without incident, but without those hobbies that time period would be smaller. Plus, those hobbies can boost your social rep. Two birds

A seem to share the majority of your " symptoms", and possess some of the ones you dont have. Fear of prison time could be a wonderful persuasive tool. So far it doesn't seem that I have the ability to fear. Or if I do Its unnoticeable to myself. I find brain scans somewhat facinating. For pure curiosity, I've always wanted to see my own results.

Good luck
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Default Feb 14, 2015 at 07:57 PM
  #7
saminsf88,

I was wondering how u respond emotionally to different stressors and social occasions. Both currently and in youth. In situations usually emotionally charged like funerals, weddings, dangerous situations etc.
Pretty much my emotional range is happy, Angry, frustrated, bored, and excited. And do u " keep up a normal emotinal appearance" or just be yourself around others? I pretty much have a different representation of myself, or fake persona, for every different person and social event I interact with, thus to get the optimum outcome. Although this can be entertaining, it has gotten tiresome at times, which can "frustrate" me. Thus, it brings out my anti-social traits.
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Default Mar 23, 2015 at 05:24 PM
  #8
@Redsoxrule

Hey bud, sorry for the late reply.

Emotions - Ah, what a subject. In most social situations, I tend to keep my cool even if stressors are present. However, overtime these minor-moderate stressful situations build up a great deal of tension which almost always leads to some sort of violent explosion of emotions. The violence can be verbal or physical depending on the occasion. For example, if dealing with a female girlfriend, the need to verbally abuse her until she is emotionally broken is necessary. For a male, perhaps during a fight, the need to harm the person until they are unable to recover, at least momentarily, is the objective.

All I can say is that the condition I have, is a cocktail of a hyper form of narcissism, mixed with some powerful anti-social tendencies.
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Default Jun 15, 2020 at 07:35 AM
  #9
The best course of action is to seek help immediately. If it might affect you financially, try going like once a month but please seek professional help
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