Ethics Boards (U.S.A.) and Friendships with Clients

Thanks for all the replies. I will continue to respond later. For now I'm off to see my kiddos.

Thanks for this thread - the discussion has been interesting.

Goingtogetthere - I'm in a very similar situation myself, and actually started a thread about it a while ago. I'll be ending therapy soon and want to stay in touch with my T. She and I talked about it, and like you, I made the caveat that if we were to keep in touch (and maybe, potentially explore a friendship sometime in the future) we would have to definitely end the therapy altogether.

I have no idea why the ethics board may have changed the rules on that, other than the fact that, with therapy broadening out to include many different styles, it may be difficult to avoid relationships forming. Also, I think society may be coming to a place where stricter rules are not as useful as just letting adults be adults, as long as no one is getting hurt.

I really hope it works out for you GTGT! I know the one thing I am making sure to do as my therapy winds down is to have no expectations about what is going to happen. I think we can get ourselves caught up in what we hope or desire, and may end up setting ourselves up for failure. Just go with the flow, and see what develops! *hugs*

Hey perna - great link. This guy touches on some sensitive topics in his posts!!

As for friendships after therapy, at this point, I'm just thinking we both deserve our privacy IRL. Like we've gotten TOO close at this point.

What about rules for Psychologists that have retired from the profession, have let their
licensure expire, etc. How can they be regulated at all? Whether it be a platonic or sexual relationship I dont see how there would be any legal implications at that point.

i am still in the process of therapy so i cant say what my feelings would be toward the end of it as im not able to even imagine being at that point yet.

my T has told me a few times that we have a close relationship and had we met on a diffierent level/circumstance that we would probably be friends...as we gel/mesh well together. she also stated recently, i dont remember how we got on the subject but we were talking about our relationship and how special it is and she said "even if you ever stop coming to therapy i think we will find a way to stay in touch"

to me, that was sweet and im not sure exactly what she meant by that but i havent looked much into it as im not there or ready for that. i do know that if i ever get to a point where i feel i dont need her how i need her right now that i dont want her to just fall out of my life. she fills a very important role for me so if anything i would probably just continue to see her off and on as a therpaist to just keep in touch/see her.

It's not about what states you are in.
You should look up the rules for the APA, the American Psychological Association. They make the rules. They don't like "dual relationships" and generally consider "once a client, always a client." (I hate them for my own reasons.)
I am sure you can find "the rules" online.
The two year sexual relationship rule is also not allegedly just that clear anymore (I realize you are not talking about that, but someone mentioned it here); supposedly a T can never be involved with a client as they are once a client, always a client...same kind of thing. (Except under special circumstances, and it was implied to me that the T would have to present a case and get approval by the board for such a relationship, and in order to make sure they don't lose their licensure. Also regardless, other Ts don't look at that behavior as "ok" within their world, even 2 years later, and are judged for it.)
Back to your situation, maybe you can get away with being a friend with a T since the rules are mostly there to protect the client from abuse by Ts...it still sounds complicated, though.

[QUOTE=sorta_fairytale;3063066]It's not about what states you are in.
You should look up the rules for the APA, the American Psychological Association. They make the rules. They don't like "dual relationships" and generally consider "once a client, always a client." (I hate them for my own reasons.)
I am sure you can find "the rules" online.
The two year sexual relationship rule is also not allegedly just that clear anymore (I realize you are not talking about that, but someone mentioned it here); supposedly a T can never be involved with a client as they are once a client, always a client...same kind of thing. (Except under special circumstances, and it was implied to me that the T would have to present a case and get approval by the board for such a relationship, and in order to make sure they don't lose their licensure. Also regardless, other Ts don't look at that behavior as "ok" within their world, even 2 years later, and are judged for it.)
Back to your situation, maybe you can get away with being a friend with a T since the rules are mostly there to protect the client from abuse by Ts...it still sounds complicated, though.[/QUOTE

I've looked at all the professional boards in The U.S.A. They are the ones that changed their ethics codes, the states followed suit. If you can provide me with the exact legal wording that was implied to you, I will be glad to look at it. I'm just looking at what is written in the here and now. And let's remember, ethics codes are only guidelines. Why do you think the boards change course in your opinion?

I just finished reading The APA dual relationships, and other pertinent parts. Nothing is mentioned regarding former clients and friendships, only sexual relationships ( im more conservative about these relationships). Thanks for responding.

Another question for you. How do therapist on the boards think friendships are not okay when their bodies pepper the ethics boards?

Struggling2, yes, it is sweet what your therapist told you about keeping in touch. We don't know what the future holds in any of our relationships, especially friendships.Both of you are adults, and if she is doing her job which is to heal you, then any kind of friendship could be possible - casual or close. It sounds to me she is doing an exceptional job. Once we leave therapy our work is far from done. We now have the power, and wherewithal to do it on our own. You are your therapist equal. You are not less than. You are a person that can give and receive in a healthy way, because you know how; you have value, and you have worth. Best wishes to you and your therapist. She sounds like she's a keeper no matter what you decide.

Also, it was my therapist that said there is no turning back. If I make the decision to be friends. To me, that's a healthy boundary.

I'm glad to hear these friendships can be successful. Thanks for weighing g in

Interesting question. I wish I knew. I imagine that someone can still and a formal complaint, or sue. If they win , the therapist can be sanctioned and/or have their license revoked. Just a guess.

Does anyone out there know for sure? Please weigh in.

Nessaea, thanks so much for your encouragement, and hugs. You are absolutely right when you say, " Go with what develops!" Right now,we are like a bunch of school girls having a grand old time. She is reading, Teacher Man to me, by Frank McCourt. We are bonding over books, etc. so, I think most will agree this is a sign that were done - almost. I just want to leave on my terms, and that is also what my therapist wants. She has told me from the beginning I am always in control of my therapy. And, looking back - I was and I am.

Thanks hankster. I feel that my therapist and I have gotten close - not TOO close in my probably six plus years of therapy in fourteen months. The development of trust allowed me to heal myself. If I decide on a friendship, I know I'll be seeing her probably a lot less. I realize post relationships are not for everyone.

Perna, your mind conjured up a good image. That's why they refer to dogs' as mans' best friend - faithful and loyal to the end. I noticed so many people on the forum have true connection with their pets. I'm envious.

I have inner circle friends that no matter what - time of day or night they will be here for me, no matter what. Sometimes I see them once a year or once in five years.We may speak once a year. As Brené Brown says, they are friends that will help me move a body - no questions asked. They know me as intimately as know others - except my therapist. They (3) are spread across the country. Will I and my therapist be like that? We'll have to see. The next circle includes my coffee group friends, movie friends, etc., my kingager is being a pain in the butt - please tell me, "I'm a good Mamá," friends. They will hug me, give me a shoulder to cry on, when life's mundane gets the best of me. A few might help me move a body with a question or two. Then there's the outer circle. We see each other when we see each other. I like them, but my tears will not flow if they move across the country. Who knows what FM (my therapist) will be to me, we to each other. We haven't even started that journey.

We both live in the city. We like plays, classical concerts, out door concerts, and discourse. We both suffer bores poorly, and we love to joke and laugh. We both want to save the world. She has taught me that I can only do it one person at a time, and that person will pay it forward. She likes hockey. I like soccer. We will either find more things to bond over, or we won't. And, that's okay. I will still have value and worth.

I did not do reparenting with her, and I don't see her as my mother, maybe, as an older sister - 7 years older. I have a mother that I love dearly.

I'd quicker see my ob/gyn at a party than my next door neighbor, Bobby, that I grew up with, and played doctor when I was nine. Thank G - I was the Dr., and never had to drop bloomers. I've been to parties with my ob/gyn. I fancy his South African accent. I am still adjusting to my body image, and professionals just don't phase me. Neither will FM. She puts on her pants just like me and everyone else; one leg at a time. I don't see her as a God or a Demi-God. She's a person just like you and just like me. She doesn't bite.

If you started a thread with the question: Who hasn't had a best friend, spouse, kid, parent, tell something about them that was never ever to be told to anyone? The thread would be postless. I can hear a pin drop as I write this sentence. It gave me a chill. This happens all the time in life. Even, if FM tells my deepest darkest secret, it will not kill me. I can recover, because I know how to recover. I have value - I have worth. After therapy is over, the real challenge begins. I can take what I've learned, and continue to grow and cement what is good.

My therapist is not in need of friends. I know of, some of her friends. She knows of, some of mine -we live in an incestuous city. I've introduced her to some of my friends at a concert. She spent intermission with us. I'm not ashamed to say I was loco (joke).
I don't think of her as having personal knowledge that she can use against me. Because, for me that would even be a deal breaker as my therapist. I call it; lack of integrity - the image of my ex comes to mind. Our friendship cannot be about truth or dare; you show me yours - I'll show you mine. I did that with Bobby my next door neighbor (see above). He never saw mine- I lied to him. I think as two middle aged women we a can work it out.

The 'peer' relationship thing. This reminds me of a recent, now ex friend of mine - thanks to therapy. All she talks about is how gifted her two little darlings are. She annoys the school, the teachers, her friends (they drop like flies), anyone she can tie down to listen. She didn't want them with little Juan or Magdelena that have average IQ's. She wanted them with Byron, Igor, and little Einstein that had IQ's above 150. She demanded that they only be with their 'peers.' Her precious darlings finally got tested this year (HS and Jr. HS) - they're just average. What a shock! Of course, the test are wrong, says mom. I was pulling for the kids to play and to school with whoever was at school. Izabella is not going to infect them with some disease. Izabella is their 'peer', along with Igor, Juan, etc. If I go with your thinking that I am not FM's peer, then I have to see myself as less than. I am not. The back of the bus days are gone - people of all kinds can mingle.

My therapist helped me heal. And, to me that's good enough to have a relationship with anyone, and now, she would love to be my friend - priceless!

[QUOTE=Goingtogetthere;3063096]I just asked my T your questions after explaining the situation via email. I will let you know if he responds...he's very cool but pretty busy.