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ArtleyWilkins
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Default May 04, 2019 at 10:58 AM
  #121
As I tell my students, understanding how people try to manipulate you is an important life skill which is why I work to teach those common methods of manipulation. Awareness is half the battle. At that point, you get to decide whether to succumb to those methods or not.

Equally important: Sometimes a tree is just a tree.

The trick is discernment between the two.
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Default May 04, 2019 at 11:20 AM
  #122
Quote:
Originally Posted by stopdog View Post
This is gaslighting.

Quote:
Back to our casual discussion a few months ago, one of my good friends told me of a situation where he changed the temperature of the room for "therapeutic reasons." I said, What do you mean? He said the patient of his had assertiveness problems but also seemed strangely oblivious to his environment, based on his many accounts of people constantly reminding him of such issues. Yet my friend had not noticed this firsthand. What he decided to do was lower the room's temperature before the patient came to see him the next session. When I asked him what if the patient asks you if you did that "on purpose", he said he would say he did that because the room was too hot for himself. He added that this is true, that it WAS too hot for him but he kept it at that temperature for the patient who always seemed to be shivering. Two birds with one hand I suppose.
My therapist would disagree with this, as we work on a way, to refer back to the term used below, that facilitates shaping myself. the concept of neutrality, rather than his interference, allows this to unfold.

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We may--we should--agree about the goal state with the patient, but how we gonna take him there means he has to trust us, do the "homework", engage us, open up to us and let his true self experience us, get shaped by us, get shaped by others in situations outside therapy...all in service of a goal state.
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susannahsays
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Default May 04, 2019 at 12:23 PM
  #123
I see both sides. I'm not sure where I would draw the line between being considerate and trying to create an environment conducive to therapy, and being manipulative. I certainly do think there are therapists who manipulate the client, as I have heard multiple clients say they confronted their therapist about something, and the therapist admitted to behavior that amounts to mind games. I myself sometimes resort to mind games with the therapist I see, but I also push myself to be direct when it matters, and I am also quick to admit what I'm doing if she asks. I am also the client and the only one sharing sensitive, emotional information. If I sensed manipulation occurring on the therapist's end, I would certainly find it difficult not to give as good as I got. Therapists want clients to trust them, and I personally would find it very difficult indeed to have any level of trust in a therapist if they were not direct about their intentions. I think I would feel like it would be necessary to devote more cognitive resources to monitoring them. It would be a huge distraction. I don't constantly analyze the behavior of others, but if I am given a reason to question their motives in relation to me, I think it makes sense that there is a certain level of scrutiny towards their behavior. The only person I can think of having to do this with is my roommate, who is highly passive aggressive.

As for seating arrangements, I think it's usually not a manipulative ploy - at least, I wouldn't characterize it that way. There are times when I think there could be an element of manipulation or covert dominance signaling, but I am also unsure if the therapists themselves are even always aware of what they have done. Regardless, I don't think I'd characterize any of the things in the OP as "sly" except for the client seating being lower. That may have been a coincidence - I say that simply because this is not something I would notice when purchasing furniture, and I doubt I would notice afterwards, either. Part of that may have to do with me being only 5'3, though. If I were the therapist, I probably wouldn't notice as I'd be unlikely to be towering over the client. As a client, I am used to most people being taller than me, so I doubt I'd notice in that case, either. The therapist I see is actually short like me, though. I do wonder if that affected her choice of couch - unlike many couches, I am able to sit on her couch and my feet have no trouble being firmly planted on the floor. I don't have to sit on the edge to make this happen. It's nice not having my legs dangling like a child's.

The other things don't seem like a big deal to me. I personally wouldn't be bothered by seeing tissues in the trash, and it seems silly to empty them after each client, but I seem to recall reading that seeing other clients' used tissues has bothered some people. I once asked the therapist if she moved the chair to make me crazy (I wasn't really serious about the crazy part), and she said she sometimes needs to move it to get into her file cabinet - so it may shift slightly from time to time.

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Default May 05, 2019 at 05:55 PM
  #124
ROFL... I think Every Single Thing in T’s office is strategic... to make clients comfortable. None of it feels manipulative and if you ask he will tell you. If something bothers you he will move it. He and the client sit in the same kind of movable office chair. Pay at the end by his desk with the professional type chair and the matching couch. Tissues are everywhere. Every picture has meaning. He usually sits facing the client with a window behind them that overlooks a beautiful park... you can’t see it clearly enough to get distracted... just enough to remind himself he is working towards you having a beautiful life outside/beyond his office. His paperwork area is barely in sight, just enough to remind him you are a client. All the pictures have meaning. He warns me when we get about ten minutes left because he knows I get anxious about time. He ends the session several ways depending on how vulnerable I am feeling or what we were doing. He goes up into the office first but it is specifically so that I can have control over closing the door and not feeling trapped. Sometimes he walks me out, sometimes not... sometimes he will go first sometimes he lets me go first. There are ultimately 6 kinds of chairs/places to sit not including the floor which he would totally do depending on what makes you feel most comfortable. I may be the eternal optimist with him but it is like everything in his office is placed for the clients comfort. There is one picture that symbolically represents his clients, one “family” picture but it is very old and then 4 other pictures all symbolic to him... but set up in a place to empower his clients through their meaning to him.
He laughs when I call him out on them... he gave up trying to act surprized or innocent the second session. But he only did that because he was (rightfully) worried that if I knew he was trying to get me relaxed I would feel trapped and scared.

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