Have you tried to get your therapy notes?

I saw my last T for 10 years. I had three thick files. She said if another T asked for them, she would give a summary. (I never asked what would happen if I asked for them). I know she kept copies of my emails on a flash drive. She said there was too many to print out. She didn't really seem to know what would happen to my file if the practice closed which was a possibility within a year of me stopping seeing her. So I really don't know if there is even a way for me to get my file. HUGS Kit

My t did not take notes for a couple years. Lately she does. That makes me nervous. Why? I asked her and the answer was too hazy.
I guess I could tell her it makes me lose trust in her and would she please stop. What’s going on, does she think I’m going to be involved in some sort of legal action and she might be asked to testify? I think my life is too boring for that.

They are masters of the hazy response. I think it is a part of how they are trained - never tell the client what is really going on.

They don't legally have to give her a copy of everything if they deem it could be harmful to her. She could sue them to try to get the records, but that seems like a waste of time and money.

If they refuse to provide notes, though I am not certain, I think you can request they be sent to your designated representative, who can be someone you name as an advocate or support person.

My T doesnt take notes but wow, who do these people think they are. It's your therapy, your money, for your benefit, not their comfort.

Hi Susannahsays,

Thanks for adding this! You are correct about this, at least it applies where I live. However, there are ways to get these notes even if they are considered potentially harmful to a client. I know Physicians can and do write notes about clients that they cannot see unless there are legal proceedings and lawyers are involved. I believe a FOIP request can also bypass this - though I am not 100% sure about how easily it can be done.

Thanks,
HD7970ghz

Not trying to be insensitive, but it seems like there are a ton of people with certain issues who would be likely to become suicidal if they read some of the things in therapy notes. Yeah, most aren't "juicy," but they aren't really written for the client's benefit in the first place. They are written for insurance, and the callousness of that industry is sometimes reflected in the note. I don't really think therapy notes have anything to do with client benefit OR therapist comfort.

And it actually comes full circle back to insurance again, although liability insurance this time, because that's why they don't have to release them to clients. It's too big of a liability to reasonably insure therapists when they might have to do this.

That's my thinking, anyway.

I absolutely agree with the bold as well. This is certainly a concern for a lot of therapists! I tried killing myself when I saw a specific document - however, the content that was written was malicious and purely lies. I don't think every therapist would write lies about clients but if they do, I can definitely see how it could push clients into suicidal territory.

Being that legal health records are my core trauma in therapy - I have had lots of time to research this stuff. Many healthcare professionals are scared to show notes to clients because there is a method to writing notes in a professional manner, considering they are legal records and must maintain professionalism and unbiased material. They have a writing style that can come across as blunt and hurtful and can be extremely difficult to interpret when read by yourself; that is why therapists offer to sit down and read them together just in case there is misinterpretation and or misconstrued understanding.

Thanks,
HD7970ghz

The whole treatment is for the benefit of the client.

If the notes can be shared with insurance, used for court, or shared with anyone for other purposes, you have a right to know what a therapist is writing about you.

Especially notes your insurance company may get-that can cause problems the rest of your life, so those are notes you may want to see to ensure accuracy or to be informed in general. Do you think the insurance company actually protects the confidentially of such notes as you would? Think again. No, the only one protecting you is you.

Personal notes that would never be shared outside of the T are not my concern. A decent T would not send such notes to an insurance company anyway (they would have a seperate set) or anyone else as they know the potential implications. But some Ts are not as smart as others and may do something that stupid.

Yes, I know of what I speak because I worked in a mental health agency and frequently had to deal with notes. I know that the way those notes are written isn't all compassionate and **** like the side of therapists that is presented in session. So somebody's therapist might be all ooey gooey and stuff in session, but then their notes would make it seem like Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde if you weren't familiar with documentation protocol. Not saying that the ooey gooey facade is the real person, just that it's not as psychopathic as the extremes make it look.

True, but when it comes to therapy notes, the benefit is in getting insurance reimbursement. It's impossible to write a client-friendly therapy note that can also be used for insurance purposes.

I can't really speak for self-pay.

It doesn't matter what the notes are written for. Sharing such sensitive information with insurance is more of a justification to see your notes, not less, so you could see the information your insurance company was given.

I'm confused about if you're trying to convince me of something here. You can say I have a right until your face turns blue, but that doesn't mean I actually have that right in practice.

I get the feeling you think my opinion is that people shouldn't get their notes. I have never said that. All I said was that the consequences would make it difficult for therapists to be insured.

Sure, most people might realize a clinical person is writing clinical notes that may sound clinical-like.

The thing is-you can find out from medical notes that you have cancer and fall on cement and get a concussion and so be harmed. Other information can harm you-you can learn of a family member's death and faint and fall to the ground. People are harmed every day from information as we are adults and information is part of life. This doesn't justify someone shielding it from you-who are they to decide what's best for you?

I do see your point but it's patriarchal for someone to decide what information an adult should be shielded from.

Anyway-I'm just killing time here tonight, so no stake in this! My T doesn't even take notes....

No, that thought didn't really cross my mind.

With the information access in this day and age, people expect more information and trends are moving away from uninvested others-normally those profiting off you-controlling it all. The thinking you are illustrating is largely reminiscent from patriarchal healthcare. I think that context is important.

Why are you debating me, then? I'm not expressing how I personally think things should be, just saying how they actually are and the thinking behind it (which has nothing to do with me).

Most people actually really don't understand when they see a clinical note written in clinical jargon, often utilizing all sorts of ridiculous abbreviations and acronyms. I'm not likely to be convinced by you that it is otherwise than I have seen for myself with my own two eyes. But I don't expect you to take my word for it.

And I really don't appreciate you saying that stating the facts of how things work right now is an example of "patriarchal thinking." That's like saying that people speaking about racism in America today is an example of racist thinking. I understand that the system is patriarchal, but to attribute that to me is what I mean when I say it seems like you think I believe things that I've never even said.

ETA: I am talking about what IS, you are speaking the language of ideology and idealism - hopefully the future. I don't disagree with anything you've said, except perhaps that people would understand clinical documentation.

The patriarchal comment isn't about you personally, it's the way the system was set up. It's realistic rather than idealistic. (I think I'm also stating the way things are....)

I'm not sure why you think I didn't believe you about clinical notes being clinical. I've read enough of my own (medical) notes to understand what you are saying.

Anyway, I thought our conversation was fine. I didn't mean to upset you.

Hi everyone,

I just want to gently interject and offer some insight - as I fear this thread may be taking a turn into unnecessary conflict spirals that could potentially drift from the central purpose of the thread.

First and foremost this is a support forum. While we all have different opinions and are welcome to disagree, bare in mind the way in which we approach disagreements and our tendency to spiral into conflict. Conflict can be handled effectively in private messaging and in my opinion - it should be on forums where there is such a diverse populace with a wide variety of triggers and sensitivities.

Let's face it, it is SO easy to be misconstrued on forums. Especially when conversing about topics that we are so passionate about, and especially when we are all so sensitive and even more-so when 80% of communication is nonverbal and we rely entirely on nonverbal writing to communicate with one another. I cannot count how many times I have misinterpreted emails or text messages or messages on forums in my own life - and if I am quick to react (rather than taking time to process and respond) I risk creating unnecessary conflict and harming others inadvertently, and often times myself.

While it is okay to disagree, I think a lot of members would prefer to be messaged privately when something becomes heated. Not trying to be a hero here - I am guilty of these things too - I just felt like offering some insight that maybe could help.

Thanks,
HD7970ghz

Notes are to protect the taker - not the client. They benefit the therapist. There are ways to get the notes but it can take a bit. If you want them badly enough then my suggestion would be to hire an attorney.