Ugh

When I started with Awesome T and I told him I have difficulties with trust he said “Trust, Starts here, With ME”. He said it in a very firm but reassuring tone. Now, just when I got to where I trust him more than I have ever trusted anyone in my life he tells me that we cannot go farther in our work until I have more trust in him... OK, totally get where he is coming from, even agree...
So... he has been gone and I have been working on an art/expression project while he has been out of the office... this has become a norm for us and I think T thinks it is kinda fun... he never knows what he will come back to. I got the artsy part done and need to do the functional part and finishing. I showed the artsy part to H and he does NOT want it in the house. It is VERY symbolic of T and has the same look/feel as T’s office... I thought I could use it as a comfort item either with T or, more importantly, between sessions when I really need to be near him but it just isn’t doable. So H is insistent that this project belongs to T and must stay at T’s office... T has not been consulted on this either...
T wants to use a weighted blanket with me in session to see if we can get me feeling safe/secure/relaxed enough to let him near infant me to nurture her. So I made a quilt top that feels like T’s office to me and I was going to weight it when I put the batting and backing on... it is lap pad size not even a lap quilt or throw... but feels like T. I thought it would be good self care... now I am sad, frustrated and neurotic.

I'm sorry you're dealing with this. It seems clear to me that your H is jealous of and/or feels threatened by your T--like, fears he will make you stronger and stand up for yourself more, for example. And he's trying to control you by not even allowing a blanket in the house. Out of curiosity, what would your H do if you stood up to him, and said, "No, I'm going to work on it at home"? Would you be under any sort of physical danger? If so, then I wouldn't do that. If not...maybe that's something to talk about with T, being able to tell your H "This is my project, and I'm going to work on it at home."


Also, I agree that making the lap pad sounds like good self-care.

I’m torn about this.

On one hand, I think you have every right to have your project in the house and you should be able to work on it whenever you want.

On the other, as the husband in this situation, I’d be bothered. You talk about needing to be close to another man and having him nurture you. Longing. The item is a blanket - an intimate item. Possibly used to lay down. I think this would be difficult for most men to digest. I get what your therapist is trying to do, but even reading this as an outsider, I’m uncomfortable. I can see how the actual object is upping the intensity of your husband’s jealous feelings and underdtand why he wouldn’t want it around.

I am fortunate that my therapist was a woman. I had strong feelings for her (maternal) which my husband could accept on some level. If the strong feelings were towards a male, no matter what kind of feelings, it would have created marital issues. I think there’s a whole other aspect of therapy that can be hard for the ‘excluded spouses’, regardless of gender. For me, therapy did create an emotional rift as my attention shifted to my therapist. My husband and I are still okay, but therapy can have a destructive side to relationships as well.

I guess my only recommendation would be to tread gently around your husband. I think this dynamic with your therapist and the treatment plan would be hard for a lot of men.

I agree with all of this. I do understand, from other things you've written, that you live with a controlling man and apparently you are not interested in changing that. Certainly that's okay.

But I think the therapeutic issue here is how much you share with your H about therapy when it clearly backfires on you at least some of the time. Enmeshment between spouses, or other people, can be very destructive to individuals. I think you need to work on psychological separation around just therapy with your spouse. There is no need to fill him in on what you are doing therapeutically, when your T is out of town, and what your therapy is about. If you want to bring him to therapy again that's your choice. But I'd suggest you think about and talk openly with your T about putting up some appropriate and necessary boundaries that protect your therapeutic space and your therapeutic process.

Having trust in your T is at least partly about protecting the intimacy between you and him. How can that be possible when you're spilling it out to your H, who then doesn't rally to encourage and support you, but controls and undermines you?

Totally agree with this.

But. I think protecting the marriage (if that’s what the OP wants) should be the priority. It seems really strange to focus on protecting the sanctity of the therapist/client relationship and boundary’ing out the husband? I would think it should be the other way around for the benefit of both relationships.

It's HER therapy, not marriage therapy. The problems caused by her therapy are because her boundaries around what is hers are not strong enough. This is IMO, not fact. It is enmeshment when a spouse who is not part of the therapy is "read in" to it, especially when said spouse is abusive or controlling. It seems to me that he's using the information she freely provides to him, to use it against her and control her further. Information is power, including information about what and how you're doing therapy, how you feel about your therapist. If you give this information away to someone who can't be trusted with it, I think you're sabotaging yourself and your therapy.

Obviously people do relationships and marriages in different ways, and I'm not claiming I know what everyone should do. I had plenty of issues in my marriage, but what I learned is being better boundaried as a person benefitted my marriage, it didn't detract from it. Mindmeld and total togetherness were not my goal. Now that I'm a healthier person in a new relationship with a healthy person, I have a greater appreciation for how my developmet away from enmeshment/codependence and towards intimacy with independence has benefitted me.

They say when you're a parent, put on your own oxygen mask before you help your child. Being a healthier person has also helped me parent my child with less dysfunction. I think the same is true for being a partner/spouse/whatever. Develop your self as a person, and protect the space in which you do that to facilitate your individual growth, don't sacrifice yourself for your relationship. In a good relationship, a partner should support your personal growth, not fight against it and certainly not try to control you from doing what you need. IMO only; this is the kind of relationship I want and what I believe. I have no investment in whatever kinds of relationships others want to have. I think the key is "want," though, not just put up with.

I'm sorry, Omers, if this comes across as unsupportive or isn't helpful. This is just the way I see it and I find it hard to watch fabulous women be taken down by controlling men. I wish you the best with all of it.

@Omers I don't have any advice because I'm not even in a relationship so I can't begin to understand all the dynamics. I just want you to know I'm listening and I'm sending you big HUGS. Kit

I hate when women are taken down by controlling men too. I haven't read enough about this particular marriage to respond to anything other than this individual posting, so I'm sure my views are missing the big picture.

It seems to me that for just this incident, what the OP is describing isn't the husband inserting himself into the therapy (trying to attend sessions or asking uncomfortable/intrusive questions), but rather the therapy coming into the home in a way that is upsetting to him. Ideally he would be more supportive and understanding, but if he's not, perhaps the OP does what you suggest - not give him ammunition to continue to be unsupportive. Yes - taking care of herself is key. In this case, I think the OP needs to make the adjustments rather than expecting her husband to change. At least in the immediate future.

Totally agree about boundaries being important for everyone, in all aspects of life. I think the challenge is our need as a client to be involved and engaged in therapy, vs a spouse's legitimate complaints about therapy bleeding into home life. From my side, I was extremely involved and engaged in my own therapy which inevitably impacted my husband at home. Be it my coming home from sessions upset and not wanting to talk about why (shutting down), while at other times talking excessively about all of my self-discoveries in a totally self-absorbed way and ignoring his needs. At the time, my therapy relationship eclipsed my marriage in the name of personal healing and growth. It took a heavy toll, which I could only see after the fact. It's a really delicate balance between getting our needs met, while at the same time, being a good partner. My husband has never been in therapy, but if the roles were reversed and I felt shut out and had to see his relationship with his therapist taking increasing priority, I'd be pretty upset. Again just my own opinion.

This is an interesting article I found a few years ago, when trying to understand my husband's responses to my therapy:

Therapy stole my boyfriend | Life and style | The Guardian

It's an extreme example, but helps to see the other side of our undertakings.

Is there any way to have it in the house without your husband having to constantly see it? I know I'd be bothered if my boyfriend suddenly brought in something that was very obviously reminding of somebody else than his family. But if it were kind of out of my sight it'd be okay. Similar example: I keep things my T gave me (like an unused tissue, a note stating my next scheduled appointment) in a drawer, but I don't hang them on the wall. I think it's okay in a relationship to have things that remind you of other people, but I can look at these things or hold them or whatever on my own, my partner doesn't need to be involved.

Good idea--I mean, I have a stone from my T but it's hanging out in a zipped pocket in my purse, unseen. The times I might use it to get comfort are when I'm alone. So H never sees it (he knows I have it, but I don't talk about it).

My comment will likely be quite biased as I tend to despise jealousy and anyone's trying to own another person, especially their personal feelings. I very much agree with other posters about setting more solid boundaries but also think that the H's jealousy is not valid (unless therapy becomes something else than therapy) as far as using it as a means to control. I would definitely tell someone like that they need to figure it out and deal with it themselves and would boldly refuse requests for not having my art in my home or not being able to explore the described methods of self-soothing and self-care. Some people get very irritated, jealous etc when a significant other compartmentalizes relationships and demands transparency that gets in the area of intrusion with a partner. I tend to be very sensitive to that and would draw a very firm line. I guess OP's style is quite different, which is perfectly fine but, the way I see, it reflects a form of push-pull - maybe that is a good topic for therapy. The many layers of ambivalence around sharing, how much, when etc.

He is OK with me working on it at home but wants it kept at T’s office once it is finished.

T and I have invited H to come any time he wants as jealously has been an issue from the start. I am trying to get H into marriage counseling but so far a no go. It is a lap pad or could be put over my shoulders so not a full blanket, I agree, that would be creepy. I have also asked H to meet some of the nurture needs that T is meeting and he has refused... obviously if T can do it then it isn’t something crazy intimate or complicated. But even simple stuff like holding me or even my hand when we talk is too much for H.

Yes, H is controlling and VERY insecure. Oddly enough having met T, H knows that T and I would struggle to even be friends outside of the office... anything more than that and we would kill eachother! As a T for me I could not ask for better... but outside of the professional we would not get along beyond social niceties at brief encounters... even H can see that.
As far as staying with H, I do stand up to him and likely will in some way on this one. Right now my son who is special needs and has mental health issues is the bigger risk to me so I am prioritizing getting him in a group home (we FINALLY have someone coming out to meet him Monday). Once my son is in a more secure place I do plan on giving the marriage a VERY limited chance (3-6mo to show significant progress) to heal given the stressors we have been through with my son... however if H does not agree to couples therapy and a few other things I will be leaving him as well.
T suggested the best way of dealing with insecure spouses is to be as open with them as the client feels comfortable.. so that is what I am trying. What I may end up doing is leaving the lap pad at the office when T is around and taking it home when I need it be ause T is out of town.

I’m really sorry about your struggles with your husband. This helps to frame things better.

I think it’s awful that you have to ‘outsource’ your nurture needs. I’m glad your therapist is willing to do this until you can either get it from your husband (sounds unlikely), or find someone else who can step in someday.

My husband can be very jealous, but he is also extremely nurturing and loving. For this reason, I tend to give jealous husbands the benefit of the doubt. Sounds like more benefit than yours should be given, based on his withholding and inflexibility to change.

I would agree with the openness but, without setting clear boundaries, some people (who handle their insecurity by being authoritarian) might grasp on it use it for control, like in this case I believe. Perhaps it also helps to be open and relatively transparent but not ask their validation and approval for doing something. Describe things and state "I will do XYX", without associating a condition with it. It does not always work but, in my experience with very insecure people, it can help set boundaries. I think one of the least effective strategies in such situations is acting submissive and responding with acceptance of unreasonable demands.

This is very wise. Most therapists do not have training in domestic violence and I've heard many horror stories over the years about how poorly therapists respond to violence and control (control is the real issue, violence is just a tool to establish and maintain control). One of the tools of control is jealousy, which constricts the other's behavior in ways desired by the controlling one, such as leading her to think she has no right to set boundaries or better yet, thinking that the right thing to do is to spill out information that can then be used against her. Sorry, OP, but I think your therapist is wrong about his approach. And people often write off strategic control as "insecurity" rather than seeing it as the manipulation and deliberate mission of the controlling one. This also facilitates the controller's control, because if it's about something he can't help and is "vulnerable" to, like "insecurity," then you are the one who ends up making the accommodations against your best interest.

@Anne2.0 T knows the one time H got in my face I put H into the wall. T is knowledgeable about domestic violence. T also knows I am very open by nature so to suddenly be secretive would be a red flag. The buggiest thing both T and I have in mind is that the most dangerous time for a woman is when the man believes she is leaving... so until we know for sure what I am doing we are keeping things normal.

That's great news about your son. I hope everything works out with that.

As for everything else, I think I would find it difficult if my (theoretical) partner was open about their therapy if they had immense transference for their therapist. I would not make the demand that your husband did, as I wouldn't feel I had the right to make unilateral demands in such a way. However, if my partner made something "VERY symbolic of T and has the same look/feel as T’s office" for use as a "comfort item" between sessions, I would be extremely uncomfortable. I would prefer to be oblivious to this sort of thing, transitional objects, etc.

I don't really agree with your therapist's assessment that the best way of dealing with insecurity is with openness. I don't really think insecurity is something that should be managed by other people, but even if it were, I can't imagine how being open about this would diminish your husband's feelings of insecurity or jealousy. I say that because I think many people who weren't already insecure or jealous might become so with too many of this type of disclosure.