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SalingerEsme
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Default Oct 25, 2019 at 06:54 PM
  #101
I don't know the workings of DBT, so maybe this is impossible. I really like Xynesthesia's common sense understanding of staying to get what you can out of it, and I also resonate with the scariness of bad, dangerous therapy or having an erratic therapist. You are right that it is negligent to treat a suicidal patient like that. I agree too with the fantastic post by Susannah that this type of direct accusation can be gas on the fire for a person already edgy about power and control. Is there anyway you can shift or transfer to one of the T's who gave her feedback that she dd the wrong thing with you? Change T's, but stay in that program? Forgive me if this is common knowledge and cant work. I have no experience with DBT. I do think it is outrageous to terminate a client by text, and that she isn't being very realistic about the severity of that . I would also want to make her face another reality. Hey, you could report her to her licensing board. You could easily give her a fair and tough review online. She isn't grappling enough, imo, with "To Do No Harm" and the ethical significance of putting you at risk that way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xynesthesia2 View Post
I don't like the punishment either and think saying you can't call for a month is infantilizing and quite ridiculous IMO. But I personally understand the hesitation to just dump this program (and the T, since she is part of the program) for simple practical reasons. I would likely do the same in a similar situation, would go back and try to get the good out of it given the investment and how complicated it would be to go elsewhere. And there wouldn't be anything else much deeper driving my decision. If she ****s up again, then I would leave. You can probably feel good about yourself for taking the high road eventually, being more skilled at communication and asserting your needs more effectively than the therapist, including the ability to make compromises.

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Default Oct 25, 2019 at 10:03 PM
  #102
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Originally Posted by SalingerEsme View Post
I don't know the workings of DBT, so maybe this is impossible. I really like Xynesthesia's common sense understanding of staying to get what you can out of it, and I also resonate with the scariness of bad, dangerous therapy or having an erratic therapist. You are right that it is negligent to treat a suicidal patient like that. I agree too with the fantastic post by Susannah that this type of direct accusation can be gas on the fire for a person already edgy about power and control. Is there anyway you can shift or transfer to one of the T's who gave her feedback that she dd the wrong thing with you? Change T's, but stay in that program? Forgive me if this is common knowledge and cant work. I have no experience with DBT. I do think it is outrageous to terminate a client by text, and that she isn't being very realistic about the severity of that . I would also want to make her face another reality. Hey, you could report her to her licensing board. You could easily give her a fair and tough review online. She isn't grappling enough, imo, with "To Do No Harm" and the ethical significance of putting you at risk that way.
I think that if I were in a larger program that it would be possible and smart for me to do that, but this is actually a private program with really only one therapist and her "team" is possibly just one other therapist who works with a completely different population...or maybe they have others and they meet remotely.

It's hard to know exactly what she is thinking. I am starting to see the no coaching as more of a relief than a punishment. I'm thinking of giving it at least one more week before I ask for it back. Honestly the suicide hotline people are way nicer to talk to. I feel less guilty about it too because I know they are already awake or whatever. But to be honest, one of my long term goals is to be able to handle my own "crises" without having to use a hotline or resort to thinking about or threatening suicide. Those lower emotion quickly in the same way that self-harm or lots of other things do, but they aren't exactly something I'd want to post on facebook about.

I think, and the TELL people confirmed that a complaint to the licensing board would probably go nowhere because she did agree to meet with me. But I am an excellent writer and I could write a very accurate and not crazy sounding online review. Therapists hate those, and I don't generally think they are very fair because they legally can't respond to them the way say a restaurant owner can, to explain their side of the story. But if she continues to act erratic and this wasn't a one time mistake, I will totally do it.
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Default Oct 28, 2019 at 03:12 PM
  #103
@maybeblue

I'm sorry about my previous posts (originally lillib, but I returned with a different name).

I was triggered by my own issues and I was insensitive to your needs.

I hope that you are able to handle things one step at a time, when you're ready. I forgot how hard it was for myself to not be ready for any swift moves, as well as how easy it is for me to flee as well.

I forgot to actually really read (and listen) to what you were repeating regarding your wanting to work things out, your wanting to work that program, and your wanting to heal. I also forgot to understand what your living in a rural environment and having to drive even longer should you find another group to go to, and another T.

I also forgot what I dealt with in the past with T's similar yet different from yours, and what they told me, which is what I thought was right until I displaced it here inappropriately in an early reply. I'm sorry if my words upset you.

I hope you are able to find lots of support to help you through this. Maybe something good will come out of all this - somehow.

(((safe hugs)))
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Default Oct 28, 2019 at 07:16 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by Lilly2 View Post
@maybeblue

I'm sorry about my previous posts (originally lillib, but I returned with a different name).

I was triggered by my own issues and I was insensitive to your needs.

I hope that you are able to handle things one step at a time, when you're ready. I forgot how hard it was for myself to not be ready for any swift moves, as well as how easy it is for me to flee as well.

I forgot to actually really read (and listen) to what you were repeating regarding your wanting to work things out, your wanting to work that program, and your wanting to heal. I also forgot to understand what your living in a rural environment and having to drive even longer should you find another group to go to, and another T.

I also forgot what I dealt with in the past with T's similar yet different from yours, and what they told me, which is what I thought was right until I displaced it here inappropriately in an early reply. I'm sorry if my words upset you.

I hope you are able to find lots of support to help you through this. Maybe something good will come out of all this - somehow.

(((safe hugs)))
I wasn't offended. I'm sorry you were triggered. I can totally get where you are coming from.

I rewrote my letter to her to make it less confrontational, but still very clear that I'm forgiving her this time, but I can't be doing this crap again. I think she was feeling guilty. She was certainly feeling anxious when she saw my husband there.

It turns out that not having coaching makes me much less anxious than having it and having to decide if I should call or not. So I'm not going to ask for it back again yet. The agreement was that she wouldn't text me out of the blue either.
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Default Oct 28, 2019 at 11:46 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by maybeblue View Post
I wasn't offended. I'm sorry you were triggered. I can totally get where you are coming from.

I rewrote my letter to her to make it less confrontational, but still very clear that I'm forgiving her this time, but I can't be doing this crap again. I think she was feeling guilty. She was certainly feeling anxious when she saw my husband there.

It turns out that not having coaching makes me much less anxious than having it and having to decide if I should call or not. So I'm not going to ask for it back again yet. The agreement was that she wouldn't text me out of the blue either.
@maybeblue

((((safe hugs))))

Thank you for replying.

Your DEAR letter was well-written, and your perseverance reveals your strength! I'm sorry you are still struggling with that relationship, even though some relief came from not having to worry about the dynamics and boundaries around phone coaching. Not all DBT groups offer phone coaching, but most support or therapeutic groups do offer "fairness" to all members of the group, insofar that the same rules and tools apply to all members, and that the only "punishment" or "negative reinforcement" offered would include termination, not a restriction of tools that are offered to everyone else. But that's just my opinion. It's great that you saw the benefits of coaching restriction, and how your anxiety decreased from it. It's not clear whether that benefit was your T's intent or not, but it's great that you're not able to worry about the dynamics involved with that.

We may never know the intentions of others, since that often requires them communicating that to us with integrity and the kind of openness that isn't afraid of litigation, reprimand, or complaints that can hinder someone's reputation. Still, there are other times when a genuine apology and honest explanation about one's intentions and possible counter-transference reduces litigation, reprimand, and complaints because they have identified the problem and are correcting it while also making amends to those they hurt (intentionally or not). Not all professionals (or even laypersons) can do that, given their legal boundaries and Fifth Amendment rights.

I read your past posts, and I'm glad you received a response from TELL. There may not be a way to complain to the board, but you could choose to see where the relationship heads and, if it heads down a path of patterns of hurt to you, you can make a public review, if that is what platforms allow, and if it is legal to do so (e.g., *not* considered defamation of character or libel). The point would be whether or not you'd feel okay about writing such a review afterward - not so much on what you wrote (as I'm sure your writing skills are superb, fair, and legal), but rather what your emotions would look like after you had published that review publically. What would you feel a year from now, or even five to ten years from now? Would you feel a sense of justice and relief in doing so, in order to protect other clients from similar harms, or would you feel any other emotion that isn't helpful to you? Those are options.

Hopefully you and your T will be able to discuss this. It's important that you do discuss this with your T and not let it drag on out of fear of how your T will react. Your T could react in a number of ways, but there's no way to predict your T's behavior in such cases. You can communicate your laments with your T and she how she responds. If she responds apologetically with explanations that benefit you, including expectations and boundaries for both of you to come up with together, then that's a good sign. But if you feel like her words are placing the ball back into your court, or the responsibility of that rupture on you, then that would indicate an imbalance in perspective concerning responsibility (sometimes referred to as gaslighting in extreme cases, but not always).

If you're going to ride out the storm together, the best thing to do is to communicate what you feel to your T. Hiding from your T only indicates that your T is not the best T for you, because there's a lack of trust and a prolonging of your needs in therapy, which only prolongs your anxieties and healing. Being open and hopeful that your T will respond in some honest and meaningful way for your treatment is a good thing.

I think most of us here are just concerned about you and how you feel with all of this, regardless of whether you stay or leave, file a complaint or not. Sometimes even valid complaints can backfire, which I've learned the hard way in life. Sometimes it's best to walk away and grieve while finding alternative treatment. But other times, it's best to stay and work things out, too. It's hard to tell from the outside looking in, but you're doing a tremendous amount of work to help you yourself figure this out.

We're just glad you shared your story and allowed us to be a part of your support.

Hang in there. No matter what you do or don't do, you are you, and we accept you.

(((safe hugs)))
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Default Oct 29, 2019 at 09:11 PM
  #106
Maybeblue. I can certainly relate to your experience. That sucked how she terminated her therapeutic relationship. I wonder if she belongs in the psychotherapy profession in the first place. Ethics is one's personal view on what is right or wrong. When you is that ethical that depends on your personal ethics. Your situation reminded me when my psychiatrist ended seeing me this way. His secretary called me He wasn't even decent enough to tell me BTW There was no warning. Bummer!!! I am not comparing Each MH professional is a disgrace to the profession.
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Default Oct 30, 2019 at 11:30 AM
  #107
I just wanted to say I would have sent you at minimum two texts if I were to say goodbye.

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Default Oct 30, 2019 at 04:17 PM
  #108
To me, the fact that you have a variety of resources for support and advice (therapy, hotlines) as needed, instead of just one person/program, represents a more advanced, efficient handling of your fragile states. I think that the problem is often exactly that clients want everything from their Ts and end in great pain when it turns out it's just not realistic. It is cliche, but having a support system is usually a healthier, safer solution and way of living that having a single source... you see, this situation is a good example: what if the single source is unavailable or unable to help?

If that coaching is not useful, especially if it just makes you more frustrated, maybe don't use it at all. As far as reporting, I don't know... but my guess is that a one-time bad attitude, like this attempt to terminate via text, would be far from enough for a complaint to be heard...especially because she did not actually terminate. I think you are doing very well not submitting to the T and setting your own plan and limits.
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Default Dec 11, 2019 at 07:13 AM
  #109
I hope you are doing well. Update?

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