I'm in a bad place

Same (both in agreeing with Xyn and what some T's have done). And my T was a bit freaked out by a few things I saw or found, particularly the fact that I knew where he was when he was away once because it was a public event and he was listed as a participant (it's a bit more complicated than that--I had reason to think he was there). He even seemed freaked out once when I referenced what area of the state he was from. I was like, "Uh, it's listed on the front page of your professional website: 'I grew up in [location.'" He later checked and said I was right and apologized for his reaction.

I've since learned just not to share what I find...well, aside from the time when his wife posted something in a Facebook group I'm in (I was a member of it before I started seeing him and had no idea his wife was in it). He appreciated my telling him, and she promptly left the group. He also thanked me for not looking through her past posts (it was a parenting group for certain issues). I was like, 'Uh...actually I did look at some of them, sorry." But he said with it being a group that I was in, I didn't do anything wrong.


Meanwhile, my former marriage counselor (I was extremely attached to him) was very accepting of everything I found about him online, even his wife's Facebook page. But he also asked me not to look around for any more information on her (at the time, I knew she was critically ill--long story--and I think there was another page on FB with updates on her health that he didn't want me to see--I didn't find that though). He was also understanding when I figured out she'd passed away (got a weird sense about things and found her obituary), though he'd said he hadn't intended to tell us about that.


I hope your T responds positively and doesn't terminate you. She may have just wanted to discuss your reaction to learning this information in person. It could be something you would have found out anyway, if she ended up taking some parental leave after the baby is born. And if she was the pregnant one in the relationship, well, obviously, you'd eventually learn that. And I hope she responds to your text so you'll have some sense before you walk in there tomorrow.

And I often had similar feelings regarding ex-MC. Where everytime I thought about leaving him, I'd start to cry. So I felt stuck in a way. Which is part of why I started seeing current T. Ultimately had rupture with ex-MC that led to us terminating. It was really painful and took lots of time to get over, but I think I'm on the other side now (though he did appear in my dream last night, so...)

I just texted her. I'll let you guys know how she responds. Thanks for sticking by my side through this.

If it was me, I would decide based on what useful things you are getting out of this therapy, in general. Cost/benefit. Also, have you experienced similar obsession about other people (including other Ts) as well or is it only with this T? If only with her, maybe ending it is not a bad idea, even though it would quite likely be very hard in the beginning, much like quitting an addiction. But if this is a larger pattern, you might just find another person for it.

I am saying these things because I absolutely tend to do "research" like that about whoever interests me, just keep it to myself. The difference is that my curiosity usually doesn't last too long about one person and there is no frustration, because it is just curiosity that most often arises and dissipates pretty quickly. Of course your situation is different given how preoccupied you are with her emotionally. I think most people freak out at least a little if they learn someone is obsessed with them, unless they personally get a kick out of that type of attention, which is more an issue IMO... Just suggesting that a little freaking is probably the normal reaction, but I hope she will be more rational about it.

In any case, I would consider the overall benefits of the therapy when deciding whether this long-term preoccupation is worth it.

Pathetically, I've developed this type of unhealthy obsession with many people in my life - the only caveat being that it is never two people at once. When I was a lot younger (I'm in my 30s now), the obsession could have been with anyone, including female celebrities. I know it's a deep rooted void I'm trying to fill (trust me, I get that), but knowing why I obsess doesn't make me obsess any less. Long story short, I would just move on to another person, so it's nothing specific about her (wow - I think I just had a revelation right there... I need to remind myself she's just like an average joe).

I really hope your T responds to your text and in a way that is helpful. I understand having obsessions about women as I've been the same for years but I have to say that my obsessions are not quite as all consuming as they used to be, if that helps at all. Having a good therapist to work through the feelings with is essential. If your T terminates you (and I hope she doesn't) it shows she sadly just isn't the right T to cope with this and many Ts aren't. It takes a very strong, self-aware and boundaried t to deal with this kind of stuff, preferably one that is trained extensively in trauma work, as obsessions like these are usually rooted in trauma. There are such ts out there and the feelings can get easier as you start to unravel them, but you need someone safe to work with.

In that case, it is probably not worth ending it with her because of the obsession since it would just shift the problem, especially given what you said, that she is a good T for you. Stories like this always remind me of the substance addiction I had - I even ended up in a professional field studying addiction, but learning everything there is about how addiction works never helped me quit while I was in it. It helped tremendously after quitting though, to remain sober, because I knew what sorts of things put me at the risk of relapse and what things in my lifestyle didn't serve me well, just created other addictive and obsessive patterns and served as avoidance.

I find the comment about obsessions being distractions from healthier things and what should really be addressed very interesting, also relevant to myself. I have a similar tendency and can see it very clearly at this point of life that it is mostly a form of psychological avoidance. Overfill your mind with something, it will keep away the anxiety about more serious and important things in the moment. Unfortunately, it never truly works beyond the moment, for me it just makes my anxiety worse because it adds procrastination to the mix and poor discipline. When it comes to people, I explored obsessions in my youth several times by diving into the relationships directly, instead of just viewing and obsessing from a distance. That was very useful for me and not something one can do in therapy. Well, some people do it, but that always ends badly. I almost always found that the reality never stood up to my imagination, often it didn't even match it. But it was often hard to tell apart these kinds of fantasies from real potential when I was young. I didn't have bad relationships due to it, per se, but many complicated ones. I actually don't like to call my past experiences attachment because they were not attachment to a particular person - that's why the person can be replaced quite easily. It's more attachment to an inner fantasy world while avoiding the real deal. And it reinforces itself when we avoid real, satisfying, involved relationships... it creates a lacking and void... which is filled with fantasy and obsession. I often felt puzzled at the emptiness and void feelings many people describe because, I thought, I never felt that way. But probably because I filled mine with fantasies and weird experiences, way too much intensity.

I haven't experienced similar for several years now and it is a relief, but sometimes still feel the pull and the remnants of the current. What made the difference? Getting more involved in my real life and dealing with things more effectively, not avoiding and escaping. Also just normal aging, I think (I am 45). I think the avoidance creates deprivation - of course we obsess then. Not sure if any of this strikes a chord with you, just wanted to share in case it sounds familiar to you or anyone here. Also want to add that my version of this has nothing to do with trauma, there is no trauma in my history that could explain it that way. It's more anxiety-related avoidance, a tendency for not wanting to deal with certain things when I don't have the motivation, and choosing to engage in what feels more stimulating and interesting in the moment. Looking up things about people can feel quite interesting and stimulating in the moment, sometimes useful, but can be completely a waste of time as well.

I wanted to let you know that when I read this, I thought to myself, "That's brutal".

Sounds like you need to mourn whatever happened to you in the first place, so you can stop repeating the pattern.

I know - that and five bucks will get you pumpkin spice vente latte.

Thank you for this!!!! I can really relate to you. I, too, had a substance addiction (2.5 years sober!) I'm sure it's all connected somehow

She responded. I still don't have a good sense of whether or not she is going to terminate me when I see her on Tuesday. I have a sick feeling she is going to terminate, but doesn't want to tell me the bad news in a text because she knows I don't have healthy emotional reactions to bad things. So, she wrote a vague response instead. I've asked her in the past about termination, and in the past (via text) she has said "I'm not going to terminate. We are going to get through this." This time, she didn't do that. It went like this:

My text to her:
"I'd like to know if you are planning to terminate on Tuesday or start the termination process, in which case I'd really like to know ahead of time so I can prepare myself. I don't want you to worry about my reaction, I just really need to know now. Thanks, I appreciate it."

Her response:
"We have to discuss how to move forward together. We'll discuss in session."

What do you guys think? I feel like she is sugar-coating termination until I see her face to face. Like I said, she has flat out in the past said she wasn't going to terminate me, and she didn't do that this time.

Please tell me what you guys think.

I think her saying "move forward" suggests that she's not going to terminate. But I also understand why you're scared. Hugs...

"We have to discuss how to move forward together." - To me, this sounds more like actually moving forward together rather than separately. But I agree, it is not straightforward.

Maybe she wants you to sit with this discomfort for a while, to think about how an obsession like this can affect your relationships, instead of just saying basically it's fine and there won't be negative consequences. In a way, if you have an addiction-like pattern, it may not be bad to be forced to tolerate negative feelings and anxiety rather than just getting an instant, superficial gratification that all is okay. It can also be that the T is upset about it and gives you a bit of passive aggressive reaction. In any case, I don't think anyone can really tell what will happen. I would definitely prepare for discussing what makes you do all the searching though, what this preoccupation means to you. Again, I very much believe there is nothing objectively wrong about looking for information online about anyone as long as you don't break into anything, do illegal things, or use fake identities to fool people. But it can still affect relationships, don't know what your experiences have been with other people. This is why I would never tell anyone, I think it is the telling that's actually intrusive, not the looking on the public web. But maybe it's good material for therapy, I don't know. I actually always have a hard time believing that many Ts don't look up clients they find interesting in a similar way, I know I would have a hard time inhibiting myself if I am curious.

I agree. I would put money on, she is not going to let you stonewall her again? Meaning, THIS time you ARE going to talk about it. Not just, she lets you off the hook and you dont deal with it until the next time you want a crisis.

Imo, it seems like she is firmly holding her boundary, ‘We’ll discuss in session’ and you are filling in that it means something negative on your own.

I do understand your fear, though.

Her adding, ‘We have to discuss how to move forward together..’ seems as if she is, again, repeating her boundary that she wants to discuss this topic face-to-face and not in text....and the ‘move forward’ phrase seems positive to me.

I would suspect that she isn't going to terminate with you based on the "move forward" comment. But she might set more boundaries and she will probably express her feelings toward you.

She might be annoyed about you looking stuff up about her. And she might feel uncomfortable and weird. But she might be more worried about how this obsession is affecting you and she might want to talk about that.

I can totally understand how difficult this is. The therapy relationship is weird...helpful in a lot of ways and not great in others. It's so unequal.

That response would both annoy and worry me more. It's times like this that I wish a therapist would give a straight answer. I know mine would thankfully, but I remember instances like these with therapists who don't and it hurts. I wish they would just give a human empathic response at such times. Ugh. Sorry, I guess this brings things up for me. I really hope your T isn't going to terminate and that you feel supported by her when you see her.

Perhaps she can't give you a straightforward or reassuring response because she doesn't know what will happen either. If she wants to have a discussion which is genuinely mutual or negotiated then she can't describe what the outcome will be at this stage. It sounds as if she will want to (re)assert some boundaries around your perceived intrusions into her life. If you can agree the boundaries, it will be possible for you to continue working together. If it is not possible to agree, termination might be a solution. Either way, it is not up to her alone to decide at this stage. That leaves you in this painful place of insecurity and lack of clarity, but maybe there is no way to avoid that.

Good point, it may depend on how the conversation goes. Like the T might say, "If you agree to stop looking for me and my wife on Facebook, then we can continue."

Do you guys think a T could think it's that simple? IMO if they did, they would have no clue how obsessions work and how to resolve them effectively. If an ultimatum like that was sufficient, there probably would be no or very few people struggling with obsessions and addictions - usually these people are already desperate to stop but can't without a great deal of complex changes. People break their own resolutions as well, let alone an external demand.