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Default Dec 05, 2019 at 01:36 PM
  #1
Hi everyone, I told my Regular T last night about my sui attempt over Thanksgiving. She was really upset. Visibly upset. She said she felt like she was going to have a heart attack. I feel like a horrible person. A stupid, awful, horrible person. I didn't think it would affect her like this. I think part of my being depressed and SH-ing makes me have a harder time recognizing that other people get upset when I hurt myself because I'm not upset about it. I have to think of it differently, like if it were one of my friends how would I feel? Or one of my coworkers? Or family members? I told her that I had told her I was suicidal last Wednesday (the day before the attempt) and she said, yes, but you've said that lots of times. But I don't usually say that I have a plan and the means to carry it out. She did ask me if I was going to do it on Wednesday and I said no, because I wasn't going to do it on Wednesday--I didn't want to mess up Thanksgiving for my parents. She said I had a bit of an attitude last night. I didn't really think so. But I wasn't going to argue the point. If she thought I had an attitude, then so be it.


She said what I did was not okay. And that we had to come to some sort of agreement. I have to call her first if/when I do something like that again. She said she isn't worried about the SH because she knows that is a coping mechanism. But she did ask me if I tried to sui because I am trying to not SH? Good question. IDK. She said even if it is 3 AM to call her. I would have to call the answering service and she told me to tell them to call her, that she said to call her, and then I would have to talk to her and then she would have to tell me that it is okay to do whatever it was I wanted to do. That seems ridiculous. Not the calling her part, or talking to her part, but there is no way she is going to agree.


She asked me why I didn't go to the hospital. I did think about it. I thought about it a lot. But they don't help at the hospital. It's not like they can give you a shot or a pill or something to make you feel better. She's like, of course not, what they do is give you time to keep yourself safe, because how you feel changes with time. I know that. I should have gone to the hospital but I was pretty worried they would just keep me in the ER for 9 hours and then send me home again like is what usually happens.


Possible trigger:
When I got to the parking lot of my T's office, I called said friend and I told her I had a very serious question to ask her. She was like, "Oh-kay" kind of slow like. So I asked her if she would hold my extra medications for me? She asked me a couple of questions. She agreed to hold the medications for me. We agreed I would go over there tonight after work to give them to her. I feel kind of embarrassed and ashamed. I'm glad I have a friend that cares about me though that will do this for me. But I also feel like a naughty child being punished. And maybe I do deserve punishment IDK.


I gave my T a Christmas card, which she loved. She said she has one for me too, but she hadn't filled it out yet. She said she would mail it to me if I wasn't going to see her again before the holiday but I have two more appointments with her before Christmas.


We talked about movies. We talked about Frozen 2. Spoiler
Possible trigger:
She also went on about some other movies and actresses and stuff that she likes. I wasn't paying a lot of attention then.


She wore the black flowers in her hair which I like. She made me promise that I will see her next week. I promised.


Hugs, Kit

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Default Dec 05, 2019 at 01:40 PM
  #2
I didn't tell her that I am still having suicidal thoughts. It's between passive and active. I don't have a concrete plan like last time though. Still don't know whether or not to tell Pastor T....

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Default Dec 05, 2019 at 02:29 PM
  #3
Hugs, Kit, I'm glad you were able to tell her. I'm not sure how I feel about her saying she felt like she was having a heart attack. That would make me feel guilty. And also might make me feel more reluctant to tell her in the future. Did you come up with any crisis plan besides calling her? It also seems like it could be better if she could give you a direct number to call, as having to call the answer service, then waiting for them to call her, then waiting for her to call back could take a bit of time. Did she offer up any other coping options/safety plan, like crisis line, other things to try, etc.?
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I hope you can stay safe...
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Default Dec 05, 2019 at 02:40 PM
  #4
I'm glad you told your therapist. I struggled for years with serious suicidality and attempts, so much of what you wrote here resonates with me.

A profound and life-changing moment for me was when my sister died. She had cancer and her death wasn't totally unexpected, but I was devastated. My family was devastated. My children were devastated. As I watched how distraught everyone was about her death, it hit me that I never wanted to purposefully cause my family to go through that. It was painful enough in an expected, medical death; I realized that adding the cause from suicide to that kind of tragedy would perhaps cause lasting, irreparable damage to members of my family. I hadn't truly allowed myself to think of suicide that way previous to the pain I felt with my sister's death, but at that moment, I realized I had to take suicide off the table.

Taking away that "option" forced me to actually start applying better coping strategies, to actually follow my emergency plan with my therapist and my pdoc, to start being brutally honest with them so that I was no longer letting my suicidality lurk in the shadows. I brought those thoughts and plan out into the stark light, and interestingly, they started diminishing. Something about the covertness of suicidality, the secretiveness, had been keeping it alive and continuing to be my default. Being out in the open diminished its power over me.

Maybe seeing how your therapist was jarred by your attempt can help you see that suicide doesn't only impact you; it impacts everyone who crosses your path.

The other issue is that, like SH, suicidal attempts can become repetitive. That's probably your therapist's concern. All the more reason why you really have to be completely frank with her from here on out, and it is concerning that already you aren't doing so.

The hospital can keep you safe. Even if they just hold you for 8 or 9 hours, that can be enough to get past the impulse to take action. Additionally, your pdoc if you have one, can be more insistent on admitting you since you do have a history of attempt.

I'm sorry you are feeling so badly right now. I hope you can come up with a healthy plan to put into place for any future times that you are feeling in danger. Utilize your therapist, your friends, etc. to stay safe and get past those moments of impulse.
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Default Dec 05, 2019 at 02:55 PM
  #5
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Originally Posted by LonesomeTonight View Post
Hugs, Kit, I'm glad you were able to tell her. I'm not sure how I feel about her saying she felt like she was having a heart attack. That would make me feel guilty. And also might make me feel more reluctant to tell her in the future. Did you come up with any crisis plan besides calling her? It also seems like it could be better if she could give you a direct number to call, as having to call the answer service, then waiting for them to call her, then waiting for her to call back could take a bit of time. Did she offer up any other coping options/safety plan, like crisis line, other things to try, etc.?
Possible trigger:


I hope you can stay safe...
Thanks LT. Nope, the whole safety plan is calling her through the operator people and giving the excess of my meds away for someone to hold. That's it. She did say I should start a book club. I told her I am already in a book club and I don't think I can read another book between the ones I read for PDOC, and Pastor T, and book club. Like I have no more time to read. I barely can keep up with reading these things.


With the SH, Pastor T is having me text (although he really wants me to call) his wife whenever I have the desire to SH. I don't do this all the time because my goodness, the woman has a life, I just text her when I feel like I'm close to giving into it. But I don't want to have to call or text his wife so it makes SH less attractive. I think what T was saying was kind of like this
Possible trigger:


I've been trying to be more open with people in real life and connect with them. I've now told six or seven people in real life about my attempt, not including T. Thing is, I feel worse having shared, not better. And the whole my T feels like she is having a heart attack wasn't helpful. She like literally needed a time out to recover. I didn't think it would be that shocking. I mean, we do spend a considerable amount of time talking about sui.


I'm glad that I told T overall though. Although I don't feel like I have that great of a plan for next time this comes up. I know I have to call her. I'm mostly too depressed and messed up and unstable right now to try to think through this a lot. So I am just trying to manage little chunks of it at a time.


I did make an appointment with PDOC but it's in February. Maybe I should make an appointment with my PCP. I don't think she'll do anything about psychiatric stuff because she is the one who sent me for a psych consult to begin with. She'll look at SH wounds and stuff though.


I think I'm sort of like, what now? I'm lost. HUGS Kit

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Default Dec 05, 2019 at 03:06 PM
  #6
Thanks @ArtleyWilkins for your response. I think that there's a lot of truth in what you say. Suicide has been on the table for me since I was 13 years old. At some point, I need to take it off the table. I know I'm not being completely honest with this T, I withhold a lot of stuff from my childhood from her etc. Not just thoughts of Sui. I did reach out to my former T who I had to stop seeing because she got MS. I emailed her this morning and let her know what was going on with me. And I'm sure tonight when I go to my friends house, we are going to have one of those "sit down" talks. Where she talks, and I listen. She's much older than me, so that's okay. I do have a PDOC. He is going to cash only after January 1 2020. The good thing about this is that he is not going to have 1000 patients anymore. (It literally takes two or three hours in the waiting room with a scheduled appointment from three months prior currently.) So it should be able to get into see him more easily after that point. Except that it is $200 a session. Cash only. So that kind of sucks. The receptionist is going to send me some information for the portal for him and stuff like that, so maybe there is a way to communicate with him if needed, IDK. Thanks for your thoughtful response. HUGS Kit

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Default Dec 05, 2019 at 03:17 PM
  #7
I don't have much to say, but I'm unimpressed that she seemed to make your pain about her.

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Default Dec 05, 2019 at 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by LostOnTheTrail View Post
I don't have much to say, but I'm unimpressed that she seemed to make your pain about her.
Yeah, I am in complete agreement. This isn't how I have experienced therapists responding to suicidal thoughts and attempts. I don't want to just keep repeating myself, but I don't think this T is a good fit for you, Kit.
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Default Dec 05, 2019 at 05:03 PM
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Yeah, I am in complete agreement. This isn't how I have experienced therapists responding to suicidal thoughts and attempts. I don't want to just keep repeating myself, but I don't think this T is a good fit for you, Kit.
Kit knows EM, Kit is just not in a good enough place to find a new T. Not enough energy.

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Default Dec 05, 2019 at 05:42 PM
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Kit knows EM, Kit is just not in a good enough place to find a new T. Not enough energy.
Hang in there. No feeling is forever. I am just feeling slightly protective because I think well-intentioned but under-skilled therapists (like ones who react to this kind of disclosure by making the client feel worse about themselves) can be more harmful than no therapy at all.
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Default Dec 05, 2019 at 06:10 PM
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I feel really sorry you had this experience because you deserve better. I know she was clearly trying to be supportive but her comments feel so wrong to me. Do you find her helpful? Would you consider switching therapists, maybe finding someone with a bit more experience?
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Default Dec 05, 2019 at 06:38 PM
  #12
Hug's im glad you told her t. I too feel like your t took it too personal. I think it's very hard for t's to react i don't know. I know my t would be deeply hurt, I have no idea how she would react. Hugs.
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Default Dec 05, 2019 at 09:34 PM
  #13
Glad you told your T. I like the idea of a safety plan. I also liked her explanation that the hospital would give you time for your feelings to change.

My T had a similar reaction when we were talking about sui.
She teared up. It startled me. I didn’t expect that. Sometimes I’m so obtuse.

Then I thought to ask her if she had ever lost any clients to sui.
She sadly nodded.

I don’t know if she was telling the truth or not. She knows I’m attached to her....and I suspect she was using that. I guess if T’s are fighting for our lives they might pull out every maneuver they know.

But I’m guessing she was being sincere because i think it would be difficult to whip up some tears that quickly unless she was really sad.
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Default Dec 06, 2019 at 05:28 AM
  #14
Is it possible she was trying to be honest with you in regards to how it made her feel because SUI people often feel like nobody will care if they die or that they will be better off without them? Maybe she was trying to show that she died. are and would be effected if you had succeeded in your attempt.

Neither of my Ts have used themselves as the example of this but long term T asked me once what I wanted her to say to my husband and children if I succeeded. They would want to know why I did it and why she didn't help me

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Default Dec 06, 2019 at 06:32 AM
  #15
Glad you took the risk to tell T.

She didn't intend to make you feel guilty or like a horrible person. To hear a client (or anyone one has a relationship with, really) tried an attempt, is both shocking and upsetting. I see her reaction as showing someone who cares about you and how your action can impact others.

Great that she is working out a plan to keep you safe.

Quote:
I didn't tell her that I am still having suicidal thoughts.
I would tell and be honest with her. How can she help if you don't share these thoughts and feelings, whenever and however they come up.
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Default Dec 06, 2019 at 07:46 AM
  #16
I am also disturbed by the over-emotional reaction of the T. Glad you did tell her, suggest you also talk to someone else you trust (you are still having thoughts?) also. Have you ever worked with a therapist skilled in DBT or CBT? Both are really helpful for developing coping skills for SI and feelings of despair/lost hope. Although you say she talks about developing a plan-----What is the plan besides calling her? What are the things that you can do yourself to calm/soothe yourself? Hang in there. ((((((hug))))))

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Default Dec 06, 2019 at 12:37 PM
  #17
Oh Kit I'm sorry you felt so bad that you attempted Sui. You were brave to be honest with T about it. I have to admit I'm not sure of her approach because it sounds like she was focussed on her feelings rather than yours and then telling you what you should and shouldn't do...but who knows maybe it's what you need to hear? It's easy to say a T should be more professional and not go into their feelings but sometimes maybe you need to see and feel their honest emotional reaction. It depends very much on the t relationship. It's not good if it makes you scared to be honest with her in future so if that's the case maybe try and tell her how this has made you feel? It DOES sound like she has a clear plan of action in mind so if this helps you feel supported by her then great, if not maybe try look at why.

Please take care...you're valued here, you would be missed so much.
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Default Dec 06, 2019 at 02:11 PM
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Please take care...you're valued here, you would be missed so much.
This. so much.
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Default Dec 06, 2019 at 04:07 PM
  #19
Thanks so much everyone! I'm so glad a place like PC exists!

I took it one step forward today. I told the owner of the company about my depression (I didn't go into the fact that I had made an attempt) but I said that I am undergoing treatment, on meds, keeping all my appointments etc. But I also said that the possibility of hospitalization is there. I told her I would give her as much notice as I could if that were the case, but that obviously in those situations, there may not be a lot of notice. She was very kind. She said my health is more important than work and if I need to go to the hospital, then go to the hospital and she will take care of what needs to be taken care of at work, even if it means flying out here from NY to CA. She also shared that she had struggled with depression for 14 years until she and her health provider *finally* found the right medication and it just clicked for her. She told me I'm not alone. It was really quite comforting. I also talked a little more to the controller and told her how bad it has gotten (though I left out the attempt part). She too was very comforting and telling me that I'm not alone, etc. I take my work very seriously and I just don't want to lose this job or something if I were to get hospitalized. I did miss 9 days of work before (but not at this job) due to suicidal thoughts. The psych doctor at the hospital wouldn't admit me but the ER doctor saw I was in a lot of distress. So he wrote me off of work for 5 days so I could get into see my T, Pdoc and Neurologist. Then when I went to work to hand in the slip, one of the big bosses was there and he was like, honestly Kit, you don't seem like you are well enough to be here. Take some vacation time if you would like, so I ended up with nine days off and then I was ready to go back to work. I feel like the hospital is more of an option now if I need it because it wouldn't totally blindside my bosses and they would have a plan to take care of getting my job done if needed. I feel.....relieved.....HUGS Kit

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Default Dec 06, 2019 at 09:31 PM
  #20
Just remember most therapists are "mandatory reporters" so if you have a plan and ability to carry it out ,you are going to have some cops babysitting you ,before you hear back from your therapist ,and if you have the above or history of above ,you get a free ride in the cop car ( they call it a "courtesy ride" to the hospital ,its to make sure you arrive alive to get some kind of intervention to help you ),doesnt mean they will keep you ,or have a bed for you ,but you will get some support .

Everyone involved would rather bend over backwards to try and help you ,than do an unattended death investigation a couple days later when your bloated and rotting ,the smell is one you never forget & neither is the horrible sinking feeling , that somebody was forgotten ,in about 90% of cases ,the dead had contact with somebody who completely missed the crisis within 3 days of there death .

So reach out peeps there is no shame in it ,any day any time you need it . If your T or P losses a little sleep they will survive (they survived residency didn't they?)

Yes sometimes it may feel hopeless ,it never is as bad as you see it ,depression has a great way of coloring everything to fit it's dark narrative .

I am sorry if this sounds like a naive "pep talk" its not ,i have been there on both sides of needing help and giving help at various times ,and being there with the silent victims.
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