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saidso
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Default May 21, 2019 at 03:51 AM
  #1
I had a new acquaintance forget an appointment yesterday, and then call and say could I wait for 30 minutes at the meeting place. I refused . I knew that 30 minutes would turn into 45 minutes or more because she wasn't dressed, and it happened that I'd forced myself to get up early after little sleep to run errands so that I could meet early at the time she chose. I had just enough energy to get through the morning in the centre of town before crashing. Rushing around an hour later would have been an ordeal not a pleasure.

I didn't flat refuse, I offered the alternative of another day when I would have slept better.

We met up later for a cuppa at home.

It's important for me to say as I feel in such things because not doing so makes me invisible to other people. I thought about people on this site while doing so. I can put up walled fortifications at a moment's notice but it's the mini-boundaries that I compromise over all the time - and feel unseen and resentful.

I'm writing as therapy for myself to mull over this. Some behaviours make me feel neglected. Anyone can forget an appointment, that's not personal, but then I want them to take responsibility, not to let it blur into me saying "that's ok" when it isn't.

Funny huh. Fortifications seem justified but little intimate boundaries not so much. I felt better for not going along with something that wouldn't have been pleasurable but simply exhausting. Better in the relationship for pointing out that we had alternatives. But... there is a subtle pressure from some people, not even a judgement, to go along with their "foibles". Blurriness comes with their territory, that's ok, but it's also ok to say in a quiet and unaggressive manner that I am too tired to play?

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Default May 21, 2019 at 07:06 AM
  #2
Congrats on your win! It's amazing how good it feels (and how hard it is) to prioritize your own needs in situations like that. I feel like in those situations, I value the other person more than they value me - and by agreeing to wait, I'm sending a message that I value them more than I value myself as well.
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Default May 21, 2019 at 08:04 AM
  #3
I wonder if all the rudeness and forgetfulness has something to do with society’s addiction to the internet.

It’s been a rant on here for me about how people who say they care about me really show me they don’t.

One example is I asked my son a question the other day and he said he’d get back to me, but he didn’t. I knew he wouldn’t ever get back to me at all. I got worked up and angry over that. Fortunately, this time, my husband texted him and said how he never called us. So he called us back and gave us a reasonable response, praise the lord!

Of course it’s hurtful that he put me right out of his mind and really didn’t care. I know I raised him better and we always had a great relationship (I thought) until recently. I think his mind just flaked out and he didn’t ever think to call me and never would have.

It sounds like your friend simply forgot your date. It’s the same thing where it wasn’t any negative reflection on you. She simply flaked. I think you handled the situation perfectly.

In the job I have I meet with people. I always contact them soon before the meeting to confirm. It’s the professional, expected thing to do. In the future, you might save yourself being stood up by doing the same.

I hate to sound bitter, but I have found many people to be flaky and uncaring. I’ve stopped trying to repair mistreatment. Although I’m glad my husband reminded my son to call rather than becoming estranged over his simply never calling again.

If you remind your friend about the next date, and she keeps flaking on you, then you’ll stop making dates with her. That is really the only boundary you can have. You don’t let people abuse you.

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Default May 21, 2019 at 08:32 AM
  #4
Well done saidso!
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Default May 21, 2019 at 12:14 PM
  #5
That's a win for you, saidso! We teach people how to treat us by our reactions to their sometimes terrible behavior. In this case, your acquaintance tried to take advantage of you by putting your needs second, but you called them out on it, by holding them accountable and with a consequence: you will not wait around for them b/c you value your own time! Good for you! I ended a friendship after 4 years of putting up with her chronic lateness, once I realized she didn't value me as a friend for constantly being late all the time, especially on my birthdays, etc. except when it was convenient for her.
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Lightbulb May 21, 2019 at 02:19 PM
  #6
Thank you ALL very much for understanding. It's an odd thing about me - odd to me myself - that I don't feel justified in setting mini-boundaries. I am so cued in to battling big things that I devalue for myself the relationship building important of standing up and being visible.

It's the impact on me internally of standing up for myself that is important: it changes my openness and energy towards the other person. Like I've had my say, then I can focus back on them properly rather than just pretending. Also being responsive about how I feel in the moment rather than rigid rules about things.

It's a subtle shifting back of responsibility - and I find myself struggling to do this on all fronts - business and personal.

Problem is that internally I think "not such a big deal". No it's not a big deal but the accumulation of petty stuff that I suck up is a big deal. Not each individual event, but my stupid attitude that I have to pretend to be ok when I'm not because I'm only "allowed" to make a fuss if it's a life-threatening emergency.

If I don't listen to my self, how do I suppose that other people will ever hear me? Answers to self on a postcard...
Thanks for getting it. Not all of me gets it myself... yet!

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Default May 21, 2019 at 02:22 PM
  #7
I'm sending a message that I value them more than I value myself as well. Yes absolutely Hvert, and I'm sending that message to myself internally all the time, as well as to others.

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Default May 21, 2019 at 02:58 PM
  #8
You make a really good point about the importance of these smaller issues versus the big ones. We have to tackle the big ones... but I wonder if chipping away daily at these smaller boundary issues adds up to big results in the end. It prevents the bigger issues from occurring?... Or at least from getting out of control? I agree with you that I also come here to write and mull things over. It really helps. More about mini-boundaries
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Default May 21, 2019 at 03:13 PM
  #9
Yes, I do think addressing the small boundary breaks is necessary to do because over time, they reflect the bigger boundary breaks. Like, that friend I had for 4 years who was chronically late. Internally, I sent her the message, "Blanche isn't bothered by your chronic lateness," which was a lie. I was bothered by it. All the time. The message I sent myself, "If I don't make a big deal out of this small boundary break, she will appreciate me for it." Um, no. She didn't appreciate me at all. The whole thing blew up on my birthday when her excuse for being two hours later to my birthday dinner was because she had to feed her cats. I had cats at the time too, whom I fed before I left for work, so that I wouldn't be late to my own birthday dinner. No one else who showed up to my group birthday dinner was late -- and some of them had their own families or other commitments.

My point is: if we don't give credence to the small boundary breaks, we essentially set ourselves up to be taken advantage of by other people over the long-term. Everyone has their own standards too. Why should you lower your standards for someone else, who has their own standards? Why aren't your standards important to you?
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Default May 22, 2019 at 03:14 AM
  #10
Yes StreetcarBlanche. I do subliminally assume that people appreciate my generosity in not making a fuss. They don't. Or, they do say "you are very patient". I am not but I force myself sometimes to be co-operative and to behave that way.

Sometimes people are late consciously because they believe they are more important than anyone else, sometimes it comes out of a generalised fuzzy-thinking state. I sympathise with the latter state, but still sending messages that it doesn't matter at all to me is dysfunctional.

It's not about punishing people, or myself for fuzzy-thinking. It's about owning... what?... that having someone say they were late because of cat feeding etc, and also in my case that person not wanting to flex their other arrangements to take care of the situation... it's no big deal YET it sends messages to myself. I have a poor conception of my own daily stresses. It is a huge stress/ and emotional challenge for you to organise a meal and have someone arrive 2 hours late.

My trivial stresses are as important as yours are - ? We all have these trivial things that come up just as we are leaving the house, isn't it! It's trivial, but still an indicator of who/ what is most important to us?

Caring means standing back a bit and saying, "I messed up by not rating you highly enough to find a way to get through my fuzzy thinking".

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Default May 22, 2019 at 03:18 AM
  #11
Being co-operative ranks high on my inner survival skills. More high than for people who are supported in their families, or supported by society generally. It was a deep part of my social conditioning from birth onwards. Self-sacrifice goes into being co-operative!!
How interesting to think about all of this conditioning inside of me, and the consequences!

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Default May 22, 2019 at 05:17 AM
  #12
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Being co-operative ranks high on my inner survival skills. More high than for people who are supported in their families, or supported by society generally. It was a deep part of my social conditioning from birth onwards. Self-sacrifice goes into being co-operative!!
How interesting to think about all of this conditioning inside of me, and the consequences!
Do you feel like you’ve let people take advantage of you and you’ve learned that from your parents’ example?

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Default May 22, 2019 at 09:11 AM
  #13
No not in the slightest. I grew up in a very poor community without "social services" where co-operation was important to our survival. I see that still in peasant communities: so much hard work requires co-operation so that people can eat through the winter. Families stayed together out of necessity, and kids worked alongside parents. Very different from buying my food ready-wrapped in the supermarket.

On a personal level, some kids on my block still grew up thinking that their needs were important, however!

There is a difference between co-operating in a stable community where self-sacrifice brings respect, and co-operating in the city where people are very competitive and self absorbed.
It's easy to gain respect for my behaviours in the countryside but in the city other skills are important: asserting who I am with strangers for example. More emphasise on psychological power games and communication. Less physical doing.

People only take advantage of me up to a point, and then they learn that I have solid boundaries. I had one guy working for me who is older and who kept calling in sick. He owned, and I figured, that his health was letting down. I bit my lip in patience for six months, then I got him to finish up his work and he retired. Stuff like that falls by its own weight if I don't stress too much about it, and that gives both people space to be human.

Also my parents died/ left when I was very young and learning to get along with other people was important to my survival.

But within friendships, the boundary setting is more subtle and that's where I let myself down.

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Default May 23, 2019 at 04:07 AM
  #14
Funny, but I had this same disrespect of time thing come up yesterday evening. Someone arranged to come collect something, changed the time, didn't turn up. While I worried and listened out in case I missed them. Told them I can't have energy to flip and flop like this at this busy time.

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