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Artchic528
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Default May 06, 2018 at 02:07 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by yagr View Post
I don't think that a person feeling disrespected is hilarious but you specifically said that the men in your life support feminism so I think that some of us, and me specifically, are wondering who it is that you are feeling disrespected by if the men you know aren't being disrespectful.
I was feeling more so disrespected by this thread being derailed by repetitively questioning my motives, rather than answering the question I am asking in the first post. This is what I have an issue with, NOT the personal men in my life. And when Seesaw laughed so passive aggressively at how disrespected I felt, I felt even more disrespected than before.

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Originally Posted by yagr View Post
I am not trying to be obtuse, or upset you in any way, really. But can you agree that many, many Trump supporters use the same logic to tout how wonderful a president he is? Or people who believe in alien abductions? Or that the Earth is flat and the moon landing was a hoax?

Each of those things might be true, but it doesn't hurt anything, especially when trying to change the world, to make sure that one is building an argument for change, that requires others participation, on a solid foundation. I know that you just asked a question, but if you are right, then perhaps we should all work together to create a change - just need to make sure that you are right.
Okay, there are many men I come across online, and in real life that aren't my within my social group, aka men I know personally, who act begrudgingly and say mean and hurtful things about feminist women. Even Trump does this. I've heard him say the rudest and most sexist things I've ever heard a man utter about women in my life!

I've seen it everywhere. I can even bring in quotes if that helps, but I'm afraid that quoting this site will have to be the one place I can't do as per the guidelines.

So, getting this thread back onto the original topic, why all of this resentment and hatred? Why do these men feel so threatened?

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Default May 06, 2018 at 05:34 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Artchic528 View Post
Okay, there are many men I come across online, and in real life that aren't my within my social group, aka men I know personally, who act begrudgingly and say mean and hurtful things about feminist women. Even Trump does this. I've heard him say the rudest and most sexist things I've ever heard a man utter about women in my life!
Well personally I think that's a yuge, bigly stretch to call Trump a man but...
And I'm not sure that online is the best example because there are definitely trolls out there who say things only to get a reaction, regardless of whether they believe it or not. But okay, I can still work with this...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Artchic528 View Post
So, getting this thread back onto the original topic, why all of this resentment and hatred? Why do these men feel so threatened?
I think that your assumption that some men's behavior is a result of feeling threatened is off. Perhaps there are a small minority of men who fall into the category you are speaking of are reacting because they feel threatened by a sexually empowered woman, but there are a majority of men who fall into the category you are referring to that their disdain has nothing to do with feeling threatened about a woman's sexual empowerment.

For instance, I'm one of these folks who believe that true strength doesn't need self promotion. I'm disabled now but I have a deeper well than most to draw from. I hold two black belts, have been a martial arts instructor, was a member of Force Recon, a heavyweight boxer with the U.S. Sixth Fleet, bodyguard, etc. Probably fair to say that even disabled, I'm a badass. No one who I meet knows this about me unless it has become germane to forward a conversation like now. I have people in my life who have known me for ten years that know none of those things about me.

Quite often when I meet a woman who considers herself 'sexually empowered', I know that about her in the first ten seconds. I find that about as appealing as knowing, in the first ten seconds after I meet someone, what their politics, religion or sexuality is. I don't care what your sexuality is but if you come up to introduce yourself to me wearing a rainbow button and your hair died rainbow OR wearing a shirt that says, "It's Adam and Eve not Adam and Steve" - I'm really not interested in meeting you. I accept you, but you're operating from a place of insecurity imo, not strength and self-acceptance and I find that rather annoying to be around - not threatening.

I recall a conversation I had with a woman once who accused me of being threatened by women's equality. I disagreed and told her that I felt threatened by double standards - no matter who is the victim. As she got to know me, she changed her mind about me...not saying that she was right to do so - or that she was right with her first impression either, but I try to be fair and examine things rather than just repeat talking points.

I find that people who repeat talking points whether it is from CNN and FOX, or the NRA and NOW and cannot take someone questioning their 'facts' to be rather scary. I mean, people die because the NRA has lobbied using false or misleading information about how safe guns are, etc. If we can't question those facts because we are anti-American or anti-Bill of Rights or anti-constitution...well that's kind of scary. Some might say threatening. I find that the one in four talking point, the seventy-seven cents on the dollar statistic, the men feeling threatened claim, these are things that no one is allowed to question without a fight which usually includes some name-calling directed at the person who is asking questions.

But okay, let me jump right in to the deep waters and address something that will be volatile - if not with you, certainly many people. I think that it is the height of ignorance and denial to think that many an actress has not tried to use her 'feminine wiles' and/or sexuality to break into Hollywood or to get a coveted part from a Harvey Weinstein type person.

Now, there is no doubt that many, if not most, had absolutely no interest in whatever guy they are trying to manipulate. I also have no doubt that many, if not most, are used to be able to bluff their way through without actually having to put out. Men in positions of power have had more than their share of women bat their eyelashes, giggle inanely, and showcase a saccharine sexuality in order to try and separate some of that man's money, power and prestige to transfer it to themselves in spite of despising him (Some might point to the FLOTUS at this juncture). I wouldn't do it, I truly wouldn't - and I don't think it's right, but I almost can't blame a guy for saying, "Okay, you want to play this game? Cool, but you're going to have to pay to play." So why do I bring this up?

Because quite often I find some women who demand equality, respect, etc., who are still trying to play subtle, even subconscious sexist games they learned from their upbringing in whatever society they are from in the name of empowerment - and then lose their lunch when they are, in fact, treated equally. Rights and responsibilities are inextricably linked. Like my kids getting more rights when they take more responsibility around the house...whether it's an allowance, or an extended curfew, or whatever. My kids demanding rights while steadfastly refusing to accept responsibility only threatens my sense of fair play.

You want a sense of the differences, read the personal ads. The disparity between the expectations of the sexes is astounding still to this day. He says, "I'm a good provider and a good listener," she says, "I want someone to make me happy and be supportive." It is ridiculous how often 'he' says what he is bringing to the table and 'she' says what he better bring to the table. Now, that is neither all guys, nor all gals - but it is reflective of the state of society and the gender divide right now. Women, perhaps such as yourself, who are prepared to actually give as good as they get, are demanding equal treatment for all women, including the ones who have no intention of giving as good as they get but think it sounds like they'll get 'more allowance without actually having to do any chores' and so they pile on board.

As I said, the only thing that threatens is my sense of fair play.

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Default May 06, 2018 at 05:43 PM
  #83
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