may trigger - Mom's of sexual abuse victums

I'm sorry for asking, but I am a mess inside.... do Mom's allow incest to happen and pretend that everything is OK..
Can that "in real life" truly happen? Where no one "talks" or acknowledges anything, life just continues?

Does the pain ever go away? Does wanting to punish yourself ever go away?

u can ask my mom she let it happen she ignored it
she ignored her daughters cries for help over and over again
her life has just continued on so has his
and the rest of my family
no one acknowledges the mess im in
no one cares (as in the family)

no the pain has never gone away and i fear it wont
i punish myself day in day out

yeah, sometimes they do.
'cause sometimes they can't face it themselves. can't face it. maybe if they did something the kid would be in worse danger. maybe they would get kicked out of the house and be left to starve or something.

dissociation.

and sometimes its about not knowing, not being sure.
and maybe in part about not wanting to know.
not being able to handle it.

it is hard.

i don't think the pain will ever go away completely
but i think it can get better.

what wood be worse : letting ur child be abused
or protecting that child
my mom doesnt even want to be with her husband anyway
so why stay
just pathetic

well...

they found that infants whose mothers tended to dissociate in response to their distress (to ignore them) tended to grow up to... dissociate in response to their infants distress.

we can't deal with / face in another that which we can't deal with / face in ourself.

the wheels on the bus go round and round...

my mother had not been abused
my mom was a great mom to everyone else
they all love her
i have 3brothers and 3sisters
and they all say mom is the best

i dont
whats wrong with me then

maybe she just got over it
and then she had a son and was great to him
i seen that
seen that i wasnt good enough
seen that i wasnt worth the effort
it was all too much to save me

sorry freewill
ive taken over ur post

BACK TO FREEWILLS POST

ignore me

when you say your mother hadn't been abused i wonder...
one doesn't need events of 'objectively sickening severity' in order for one to legitimately feel traumatised.
trauma can be defined as intensely negative emotion that is not adequately soothed / held / processed by (m)other.
i don't know that there is anybody in the world who hasn't had that kind of trauma it is just that when it occurs against a basic backdrop of support then people are more resilient.

i don't know what the difference is between you and your siblings. most likely a combination of things...
some people are more sturdy or resilient due to biological factors (that is to say that they are slow to emotionally respond, their responses aren't as intense, and they are fairly easily soothed back to emotional baseline).
some people dissociate from their traumatic experiences all their lives... it could be that your brothers and sisters are still doing that because that is how they cope. it could be that they had similar experiences to you but that they have blocked them from memory.
it could be that environmental events happened to you that didn't happen to them. maybe you got sick and your mother tried and tried and tried to soothe you but your need exceeded her ability to soothe you. and so... she may have dissociated from your need in order for her to cope whereas she didn't need to do that for your siblings because they weren't as distressed.

it is most likely to be some kind of combination...

i answered you because i didn't want to ignore you
(like what happened with your mother)
and because it seems to me that this thread is about
why
why
why
people ignore others distress.
ESPECIALLY the people who we think are precisely the ones who should soothe it.

Yes, it definately happens.

Been thinking about the why...Why they close their eyes:

1) afraid to be beaten by husband

2) glad someone else has taken over the role of lover to a man they hate

3) afraid to "rock the boat" and lose safety of a home

4) they think it happens in most families - the cycle continues

5) they learned at an early age that it's better to say quiet

6) they are WAY screwed up and jealous of the relationship. Ugh.

Anyone wanna add to the list?

All of the above are NOT excuses. This should never happen. All parents
are supposed to do..the ONE thing they are supposed to do...their ONE job...
is PROTECT THE CHILD. Jeepers. It's friggin' simple, isn't it???

Grrrrrr

em

distracted by their own distress

if u cannot handle the fact that one must give everything up for the safety and health of a child
why have the child
she should have just left me
just dumped me with someone else

i think its worse that she kept me in that house
with him

but what do i know im not a mother
and nor will i be
for fear i will destroy my child/childrens lives because im a fkd up person and disocciated in the first place

this is a really hard thing to deal with
a really really really really really hard thing
to see that the person who should have protected and supported us
didn't protect and support us adequately
to think:
why?
why?
why?
and to be deeply afraid that it is because one is deeply flawed and unacceptable

it is hard, yeah.

i think...
that people do the best they can.
that sometimes their best isn't good enough, to be sure
but i really do think...
that people do the best they can.

i don't think that i'm ever going to have kids either.
because i don't think that i could be a very good mother to them.
if they were distressed that would most likely result in my being distressed
rather than them being distressed and my being calm enough to soothe them
i'd probably have to dissociate from their distress in order for me to cope
in order for me to be functional enough to meet their basic needs such as needs for food and shelter and diaper changes and stuff like that

should i not have kids?

it is a hard one.
i'm glad you are here bronee.
i'm so sorry that you have had such a hard time in your life
i'm so sorry that you feel so much pain
i'm so sorry that you (rather understandably) wish that you never had been born into such pain and suffering
but if your parents hadn't had you then you wouldn't be here

it is hard.

i think it can be hard for mothers (in particular) to know whether the kids will be better off if they leave their abusive partner or not.
especially if the abusive partner is keeping food on the table and a roof over their heads.
the mother might be worried about basic needs like food and shelter.
the mother might not believe that she can provide anything better for her kids
the mother might be terrified of being along in the world
the mother might have been trying the best she could to do the best she could by her kids
and sometimes that can be hopelessly inadequate to be sure
it can be so very hard.

but i'm glad you are here.

i think that one is able to transcend ones past.
it takes a lot of hard work to be sure.
but facing stuff (like you are) is the first step.

i've read some stuff on interventions that are being offered to infants at risk in the US.
mothers who have been treated for attachment disorders.
they go along to group and the therapists teach the mothers to be more in tune with their infants.
to see what their infants need.

there was one case where the mother had post-natal depression.
her infant seemed to be mirroring her state so the infant seemed to be very quiet and kind of sad too.
the therapist held the infant (this is before stranger anxiety)
and smiled.
the infant smiled.
the therapists smile got wider.
the infants smile got wider.
the therapist grinned.
the baby grinned and as it grinned he placed the infant in the mothers arms.
the mother grinned.
and the mother and infant connected (bonded).

and people who dissociate from their infants distress too.
they can be taught what to do to soothe their infants.
seeing that they can be effective in soothing them empowers them to become aware when their infants are distressed and to adequately soothe them.

with follow-ups more infants were secure in their attachment.

one can learn to be a good mother.
i think part of it might be about being in a healthy relationship and maybe taking more steps than most to learn how to emotionally connect with and look after your kid
one doesn't have to be a perfect mother.
just 'good enough'
and to trust that disruptions can be worked through and transcended
yours can
and so can your kids

but time...

give it some time to heal.

if i wasnt here i woodnt know anything then at all i woodnt exist so how can one care

i rather have lived in a gutter eating road kill than living in fear of my father
but thats just me

i hear you.
fear is hard.

but i hope you can take some comfort from my words.

they are there anyway
offered to you
doesn't make things right
(of course it doesn't make things right)
but some soothing thats offered
to you

yes, freewill, it happens a lot. i can tell you, as a victim, and as a therapist. i don't have the answers either of the "whys, hows, whats?" because i dealt with my own situation and have a hard time with others due to the anger it causes me.

it is the one situation that i feel i really have a problem with with a patient. and i just found out from a geratric patient last week that he was abused and his mom knew it. he is 90 and i am the first person that he has told about his childhood. it was so sad, i thought i was going to faint. we both cried and cried.

i wish i could help you more. i just don't understand it. i am of the belief that the parent protects the child. period. and i didn't get that.

i am so sorry that you are experiencing pain about this. if you want to talk more, PM me......xoxoxo pat

</font><blockquote><div id="quote"><font class="small">Quote:</font>
alexandra_k said:
i think...
that people do the best they can.
that sometimes their best isn't good enough, to be sure
but i really do think...
that people do the best they can.

</div></font></blockquote><font class="post">

I disagree. I am so sick of covering for moms and saying they did the best they can, but the men who hurt us didnt. I think its splitting. To me.. even if it was difficult and they couldnt address it, they could get help in other ways. I think we revere women/mothers to the point of saying they are trying so hard, but situations prevented them from helping us. However, the men who have the urges to hurt... we'd never make that same excuse for. This is not a rant against you alexandra.. so forgive me. I'm just fed up with making excuses and ppl telling me that about my own mom. Everyone wants to excuse her.. and I dont understand their internal motivation and drive to keep me from being mad at her.

ester i can agree to that
my mom needs no more excuses she has plenty im sure
if only should wood at least share those with me
but the topic of my life is so taboo who wood touch it in my family
((ester)) safe hugs
just as we need to face the truth accept and learn to cope so do they
if i dont get to make excuses for the way i behave then why should she get to have excuses...

> I am so sick of covering for moms and saying they did the best they can, but the men who hurt us didnt. I think its splitting. To me..

ah. well... i never said that. i hold the same standard for men and women. i think that every person, every single person, does the best they can with what they have at the time.

i'm a determinist, basically. causal processes... causal processes...

but i hold the same standard for both, yeah.

and what is liberating about that... what is truely liberating... is that i try and apply the same standard to myself. i mess up sometimes, yeah. i hurt people sometimes, yeah. but i did the best i could with what i had at the time. and of course i did wrong (we all do wrong sometimes). but i can learn to do better so it turns out differently next time. but it is liberating for me to not feel like i have to beat myself up for my mistakes... but the only way i can get that is to... try and stop beating other people up for theirs.

that doesn't take away the pain.
that doesn't take away the pain and anger and despair and hopelessness and helplessness etc that resulted from their (my?) actions.
that doesn't undermine the fact that what they did was inadequate / hurtful in so very many ways.
that doesn't undermine the fact that they should be prevented from doing it ever again.

but it makes me consistent, i guess ;-)

again:

it doesn't excuse it.
it doesn't undermine your very real (and very understandable) hurt and rage

but it does...

something...

it does.

I can honestly say my Mom didn't know. If she did she would have killed my cousin. I know because I waited until I was 45 to tell her what happened to me at 9 years old.
I have absolutely no doudt she would have killed him and I was afraid then my Mom would go to jail and who would take care of us 5 kids without a Dad? My cousin died last year he was 56 years old and a nothing of a man. No job, a drunk and alone. I think he was delt with by the higher powers.

This is such a difficult topic for me

(((((((hugs to all who suffer from this)))))))

Yes, it is true.

Pass along abuse is so true. Mothers ignore, yes they do. Mothers dissociate too. Mothers are both aware and unaware.....Mothers didnt always protect us like they should have and they allowed us to be abused throug their ignorance, neglect, abuse and dysfunction.

They left us in a mess and they left us a mess.

The pain never goes away IMO. But talking about it and shining the light makes us able to carry on at least some of the time,

Take gentle care

Mom was abused and Mom abused both male and female children. I was her favorite. It was love, hate she had for me. So jealous, cause I seem to be what she always wanted to be. I think she was/ is multiple, as in DID. Now they say she has Alzheimer's.
I understand the not wanting to see the same happening to my children. God forgive!! I couldn't let myself see it, believe it, cope with it. I ran away, giving my ex-husband and new wife custody of son and daughter when I joined the Navy. I thought they would be safe with them and I was wrong, but that's another story I really don't care to go into now. I guess you could say my Dad was the one unaware. He was a truck driver and gone most of the time.