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Default Jun 04, 2019 at 09:33 AM
  #61
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Originally Posted by Pfrog View Post
Been following this for several days and am gonna interject my two cents here for what it's worth ...

As a survivor of horrendous bullying and abuse (and as someone who DID NOT become a bully or abuser) - yet while also understanding cause and effect (ie. how those being bullied and abused can - and often do - grow up to also be bullies and abusers) ...

As long as y'all know that no amount of realization, reflection and/or regret ... Nor heartfelt apologies and sorrow ... WILL EVER UNDO THE DAMAGE DONE to those who survived and/or were wrecked by your bullying and abuse, then I'm okay with you expressing your remorse here.

However, accepting said apologies from any bully or abuser is a whole other matter!

Some things are simply unforgivable - especially when it results in permanent harm to those on the receiving end of such behavior!

Perhaps, this is why those types of behaviors are best left explored in private therapy, (& AA, and whatnot) instead of publicly, because it just appears gratuitous and self-serving when done out in the open like this.

Sincerely,
Pfrog

*Re-Posted With Edits By Pfrog!

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I hear you and I thank you for giving me much to think about.

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Default Jun 04, 2019 at 10:03 AM
  #62
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Originally Posted by TunedOut View Post
I did not think of them as exotic. I think of it as Korea and Japan, while quite different, have a definite Asian culture vibe. While I have never been to China, I find the history of China to be fascinating. The culture, philosophy and innovative thinking is as sophisticated as Western culture (I would not want to judge which is more sophisticated only trying to say that Asian culture has a different vibe and I do not understand it all but a lot is going on there. There is much to learn from it.) In Okinawa, they traded with China and their cultural ties went back farther with China than with Japan even though Okinawa is now Japan (a prefecture of--sort of like a state).

Thailand had a bit of Asian vibe but also had a vibe that wasn't like Japan and Korea. It had a bit more of an anything goes feel to it. Did not spend enough time there and have not done enough reading to quite describe it. The people were very friendly and easygoing. The one thing I disliked about it was that I saw instances of VERY young women (I am talking about women who looked younger than 16) participating in prostitution. I did not see it much, but when I did, it turned my stomache.

Singapore had a bit of an Asian vibe but also seemed extremely orderly. I traveled to Germany in the 80s and Singapore's streets where even cleaner than Germany's. We were warned that the country had extreme consequences for littering and graffetti. Obey every rule as if your life depended on it.

The Phillipines reminded me a bit of Mexico. Very poor, lots of government corruption. Friendly people and great food. Most of the citizens are Catholic. In Japan, Korea, China, Thailand, and Singapore, other religious practices and philosophies are part of their cultures.
@TunedOut

I agree; different cultures are that, different. Not better or worse, they vary. It fascinates me to see different cultures and the characteristics that reflect their philosophies.

Yes, prostitution breaks my heart. Anyone forced to resort to that lifestyle must be a living nightmare.

Well, today, I am googling and exploring the cultures of the Far East!!! Thank you!!!!!

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Default Jun 04, 2019 at 02:20 PM
  #63
@Pfrog, don't you agree from your experience that bad abusers very seldom become repentant later in life, try to make amends, try to apologize? That many people with abusive behaviour, bullies, manipulators, narcissists etc. maintain into their old age that all they did was right? And that that can be extra painful for the victim?

Just a question, because that's my experience.
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Red face Jun 04, 2019 at 02:43 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Poiuytl View Post
@Pfrog, don't you agree from your experience that bad abusers very seldom become repentant later in life, try to make amends, try to apologize? That many people with abusive behaviour, bullies, manipulators, narcissists etc. maintain into their old age that all they did was right? And that that can be extra painful for the victim?

Just a question, because that's my experience.
Absolutely, Poiuytl ... Absolutely!

I also think it's possible that some bullies and abusers do come to realize the things they've done are wrong and are actually truly sorry for the harm it's caused.

It doesn't undo the past, but it is nice to know they are at least trying to be a better human being in the here and now.

I think this may be where that thing about grace comes in, but I struggle with believing in all that because my abusers completely wiped all that out for me.
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Default Jul 13, 2019 at 08:59 PM
  #65
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My family bullied me so much I not only ended up clinically depressed and burdened with Complex PTSD, I became learning impaired and have traumatic amnesia. I have written what I remember from my childhood and it didn't even take 3 pages. The rest is locked up in my memory that I may never retrieve.

My family taught me to bully others and when I did, the behavior came out of nowhere. I remember one neighborhood girl I was horrid to. I remember saying to her what my mother and sisters said to me day in and day out. I made that poor child cry and I remember feeling bad about that. I didn't know what to do. I thought her behavior justified my talking to her the way I did.

That is just one snapshot of my background. I am not looking for sympathy. I am simply sharing why I became a bully like my mother and my sisters. I was their victim first, but I became a bully also. I would give anything if I could go back and change it.
Have you thought about looking for her and apologized to her?
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Default Jul 14, 2019 at 09:31 AM
  #66
@HappyCrafter, you are a miracle story and a most incredible person. Thank you for sharing this. I am so proud of you for overcoming your old bullying ways and for wanting to help others now. Very commendable! I wish more people could be like you.
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Default Jul 14, 2019 at 10:43 AM
  #67
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Yes, I have. She is not the only person I owe apologies to. I am working towards doing exactly that.

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Default Jul 14, 2019 at 10:47 AM
  #68
Happy Crafter, it takes a lot to share what you just did. You are a strong woman.
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Default Jul 14, 2019 at 10:47 AM
  #69
@golden_eve

Thank you, honey!!! Thank you a thousand times!! My life is so much better now than how it was when I was a bully and drinking heavily. I am happy to share my story if it helps people.

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Default Jul 14, 2019 at 10:59 AM
  #70
@Misery Business

Thank you, babes!! It took a lot of work to get me there; I am grateful for every bit of it!

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Default Jul 14, 2019 at 01:34 PM
  #71
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@Buffy01

Yes, I have. She is not the only person I owe apologies to. I am working towards doing exactly that.
I'm glad that you are trying to make amends. I only had one bully who ever apologize to me after high school!
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Default Jul 14, 2019 at 06:16 PM
  #72
After many years of dealing with childhood and adult trauma, I have developed a few theories. I think if as a child, the abuse is constant or on an "as needed" basis one sort of mentally removes themselves from it. Also I think we begin to act on autopilot, and perhaps model the actions of the abuser. Definitely our defenses are up and we react the only way we know how to adult issues. I think it's a matter of maturity, age and experience, when we begin to observe our own actions and determine if help is needed. Of course help won't work unless you are open to it. Some folks seek help but don't let it in.

I know myself...I have come to understand somewhat why I did certain things. I think as an abused child we don't stop to think about our actions, I know I didn't. Now that I have some understanding of my actions I can forgive myself for most of them. It's easy to hang onto the guilt (as we were programmed to do as children ) but understanding where the behavior came from can ease your conscience. I know I'm not the same person I was at 20 or 30. The other "me" did those things.

Some people come to understand themselves earlier than others. I guess I'm a slow learner. I wasn't a horrible person, let's just say I was quirky.

IMO therapy can only work if you want it to and no one can help you unless you accept their help. Therapy is a tool, you have to do the work.

Remember YOU are a survivor!

P.S. Happy Crafter, congratulations for overcome your addictions. That is quite an accomplishment! (hug)

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Default Jul 15, 2019 at 07:17 AM
  #73
@happy crafter: do you think active alcoholics are inherently bullies? I was thinking about this at my Tuesday night meeting last week. I never thought I was a bully but at the same time arguing and slurring and being a demanding mess could seem like bullying to my loved ones. Would love to hear your thoughts on this.

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Default Jul 15, 2019 at 08:12 PM
  #74
@IrisBloom
@sarahsweets

I have read both of your messages and will respond to them tomorrow when my brain is fresh!! It's tired at the moment. xoxoxoxox

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Default Jul 16, 2019 at 08:16 AM
  #75
@IrisBloom

I hear you. In my case, I blocked out almost my entire childhood. I barely remember any of it. I sat down a while back and wrote out what I could remember. I remember less than 3 pages of standard paper size and Ariel size 11 font. And most of what I can remember is abuse.

I started searching for answers because my life was so different from others. I really don't know if it would have been best for me to learn the truth about my background when I was younger. I don't know if I could have managed the size of it.

So, on being slow learners, LOL I am 62. We are in good company, you and I!!

@sarahsweets

Alcoholism and bullying are both symptoms of anger and insecurities that are untreated. For me, being overwhelmed with money problems and not knowing how to problem solve, I resorted to the easiest escape. So, my problems just got worse and I kept drinking to not face the messes I had created myself.

I can remember several times I abused people when I was sober and when I was drunk. It took me a ton of work to understand why I behaved how I did and to accept it. But that hard work benefited me because I can see the behavior for what it is. I can see how the bad habits get locked in place and how to stop. I had to heal the parts of me that hurt because that was the foundation of why I bullied and took my anger out at others.

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Default Jul 16, 2019 at 04:25 PM
  #76
@IrisBloom
@sarahsweets

I thank you both for your kind words!! xoxoxox

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Default Jul 16, 2019 at 06:17 PM
  #77
I've had several bouts of drinking. I quit on my own each (!) Time...3 I think. Never did drugs not even weed. I was a pretty mellow drunk mostly. My mouth caused some...ok a lot of offense at times. I did things I'm now ashamed of. I wont do them ever again, I do wrestle with guilt at times. I try to put the past in the past most of the time.

Btw, I didn't realize you were old like me lol

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Default Jul 17, 2019 at 06:49 AM
  #78
@IrisBloom

I hear you! I wrestle with being embarrassed by things I did, also. But, they are part of who I am today. So, I try to focus on what I can do better today.

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Default Apr 22, 2022 at 05:52 PM
  #79
One of my classmate a year after I graduate from high school? One of my bullies apologize to me for bullying me who didn't know what kind of stress he was putting on me. One of the trolls had apologized for cyberbullying me and it wasn't anything that I had said it was just that she didn't agree with what I had said about a youtube video until she found out that her hateful comment to me was affecting her younger sister.

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Default May 25, 2022 at 07:46 PM
  #80
I finally apologized to my sister for interfering with my sister social life with her best friend when I was twelve years old. It felt good to let go of the shame and the anger I had felt for so long.

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Everyone can do magic - Cassie Nightgale the good witch.

Dear Diary today will be different today I can smile it will be genuine because today is the day I get to live.

This life will be good and beautiful, but not without heartbreak.

In death come peace. But pain is the cost of living.

Like love, it's how we know we're alive.

And life goes on.

That my life weird, messy, complicated, sad, wonderful, amazing, and above all epic and I owe all to Stephen. - Eleanor Gilbert Vampire Diaries
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