"You can be honest and still play by the rules of society"

Hi all,

I still remember this quote by Dr. Phil, he said it to a young man who was severely abused psychologically as I was in my childhood. Unfortunately I didn't save this video and can't find it anymore.

I thought maybe someone here can help me find it again? Or even more important, can help or guide me in the right direction, where I can find answers to the question why the message of this short video clip felt so important to me?


Are psychologically abused children prone to be overly honest and not wanting to play the games of society? If so, why is that? Maybe someone could tell me a self-help book/guide me in the right direction where I could find answers to this question?

Thank you all very much in advance for your help.

Monty

Hello Monty: Thank you for bringing your concern here to PC. I cannot be of help with regard to the Dr. Phil quote you're looking for. However I noticed this is your first post. So... welcome to Psych Central. I hope you find PC to be of benefit.

Thank you @Skeezyks for welcoming post. I really appreciate it.

I sadly couldn't find the clip you're talking about, I'll have to do some more digging. Personally, I read that quote as something that applies to people who mask cruelty as honesty. I've personally heard it time after time, where some guy says something horrid and rude, and when they're called on it, they put up their hands and go "Hey, I'm just being honest!" I think the Dr. Phil quote means that there's a way to be an honest person without being rude and needlessly hurting people.

I'd have to see the full clip to get the context, that's just what I gathered from the quote haha.

Remember hearing that. Hope you can find it. I wonder if it doesn't relate to the fear that if we do something *wrong* there will or was consequences. So got to know the rules & obey them. Behaviour rules, manners, good in school, excellent at job etc. Recently learned there would be no repercussions if didn't answer the phone or door. Just cuz we didn't want to! First time we did it we sat in the bathroom thinking of excuses..we were in shower, out back didn't hear. Worried she'd see our car. Worried she would be mad, confront us. Knew we'd be in trouble if we didn't invite her in, offer coffee, converse all afternoon even tho there were things I needed to do. Didn't happen. Saying no is a whole other issue! Welcome to group.

Hi,

I find this an interesting concept: that those who are abused are more likely to be honest.

I have also struggled with this in my own life. I have several theories as to why, but this is coming from my own personal recovery journey, so take it with a grain of salt.

I think I have seen literature on complex PTSD talk about how trauma and abuse has a large impact on molding our moral compass; however, that is a correlation not a causation. There are many children who are abused and become abusers themselves (psychopathy) - on the flip-side - there are many abuse survivors who become extremely caring and empathic for fellow survivors and find solace and recovery through post-traumatic growth; advocacy and other efforts to make the world a better place. What determines this is a topic for debate and has been blamed on a complex marriage of nature and nurture.

From my understanding, when someone goes through severe trauma and or abuse, it forever scars them. Abuse also carries with it some extremely important insight about human nature and how disgusting the world is. It is truly disturbing. Learning to survive in this world is especially hard when we have been abused and our moral compass is out of whack. Thinking for ourselves is sometimes seen as wrong or shameful when we have grown up in toxic shame.

As far as being honest and playing by the rules - I know for myself, that I am extremely honest. I would actually say I am too honest; in that I seem to attract abuse because I am so honest. My trauma in healthcare and the fact that I keep pushing an advocacy agenda against the corrupt and unethical healthcare profession has brought me a ton of extra trauma and lot of enemies. Ironically, it is the fact that I am so honest that this is happening in the first place, however, according to their documentation (which they have altered, falsified and deleted in a mass smear campaign in preparation for lawsuits and complaints), I have been labelled as a liar and manipulator, etc. It is extremely easy for healthcare professionals to intentionally write inconsistencies in my charts (based on what I tell them) and later claim that I lied. Of course, this is not true, but unfortunately their system affords this kind of power for situations just like these. The psychopathy in the healthcare professional is flourishing! SOO easy for them to destroy you, and they do. Classic smear campaign tactics when destroying the credibility of potential whistle-blowers / litigants / abuse survivors.

As much as it hurts to know this, I keep pushing the envelope because I know the truth deep down. I am an honest, genuine, compassionate and overly sensitive / empathic individual, and no amount of abuse will destroy that. I will never succumb to their level of psychopathy. Someone in a complex PTSD group recently said something about the importance of remaining a man of honesty and integrity, despite all the trauma and the reactions we may want to enact.

I didn't really answer any of your questions but I hope I added to the conversation a little.

Thanks,
HD7970ghz

Quote:

Originally Posted by HD7970GHZ Hi, I find this an interesting concept: that those who are abused are more likely to be honest. I have also struggled with this in my own life. I have several theories as to why, but this is coming from my own personal recovery journey, so take it with a grain of salt. I think I have seen literature on complex PTSD talk about how trauma and abuse has a large impact on molding our moral compass; however, that is a correlation not a causation. There are many children who are abused and become abusers themselves (psychopathy) - on the flip-side - there are many abuse survivors who become extremely caring and empathic for fellow survivors and find solace and recovery through post-traumatic growth; advocacy and other efforts to make the world a better place. What determines this is a topic for debate and has been blamed on a complex marriage of nature and nurture. From my understanding, when someone goes through severe trauma and or abuse, it forever scars them. Abuse also carries with it some extremely important insight about human nature and how disgusting the world is. It is truly disturbing. Learning to survive in this world is especially hard when we have been abused and our moral compass is out of whack. Thinking for ourselves is sometimes seen as wrong or shameful when we have grown up in toxic shame. As far as being honest and playing by the rules - I know for myself, that I am extremely honest. I would actually say I am too honest; in that I seem to attract abuse because I am so honest. My trauma in healthcare and the fact that I keep pushing an advocacy agenda against the corrupt and unethical healthcare profession has brought me a ton of extra trauma and lot of enemies. Ironically, it is the fact that I am so honest that this is happening in the first place, however, according to their documentation (which they have altered, falsified and deleted in a mass smear campaign in preparation for lawsuits and complaints), I have been labelled as a liar and manipulator, etc. It is extremely easy for healthcare professionals to intentionally write inconsistencies in my charts (based on what I tell them) and later claim that I lied. Of course, this is not true, but unfortunately their system affords this kind of power for situations just like these. The psychopathy in the healthcare professional is flourishing! SOO easy for them to destroy you, and they do. Classic smear campaign tactics when destroying the credibility of potential whistle-blowers / litigants / abuse survivors. As much as it hurts to know this, I keep pushing the envelope because I know the truth deep down. I am an honest, genuine, compassionate and overly sensitive / empathic individual, and no amount of abuse will destroy that. I will never succumb to their level of psychopathy. Someone in a complex PTSD group recently said something about the importance of remaining a man of honesty and integrity, despite all the trauma and the reactions we may want to enact. I didn't really answer any of your questions but I hope I added to the conversation a little. Thanks,

A beautifully written post! I resonate strongly with it.

I wonder if it means to be literally honest-like not lie or deceive- in order to reintegrate into society in a personal truth kind of way?